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A great deal of the flavoring from bourbon casks goes into the bourbon. American straight whiskeys always require new, charred oak. Hmmm, I wonder if any Scotch

A great deal of the flavoring from bourbon casks goes into the bourbon. American straight whiskeys always require new, charred oak. Hmmm, I wonder if any Scotch gets aged in casks that were used for rye whiskey, and how much difference there would be compared to a bourbon cask? Scotch can be aged in any oak, new or previously used, and more recently, there have been other types of casks (such as port, or French oak) used for either aging or short-term finishing.

tptacek 8y ago
I doubt there would be much difference between ex-rye and ex-bourbon. The first fill of American spirit strips most of the flavor out of the barrel and doesn’t leave really anything behind. (There’s a cool Woodford Reserve demo bottling you can get that demonstrates this).
- HillaryBriss 8y ago
  In Scotland, ex bourbon barrels go through a process of "rejuvenation" to expose flavor bearing compounds still found deeper in the wood: "... why not scrape out the inside of the cask and toast it again? After toasting the cask is charred anew, and voilà: You have a new, activated cask. ... A bourbon cask, used for 2 to 4 years in the USA, can be used for another 30 years in Scotland." https://www.whisky.com/information/knowledge/production/details/maturation-in-casks.html https://www.whisky.com/information/knowledge/production/deta...
  - tptacek 8y ago
    Right, the casks still work, but it's not like aging scotch in William Larue Weller casks works any better than Jim Beam casks. It's just a source of oak.
    - dluan 8y ago
      Until someone tries this and shares a sample with me, I would bet that it would taste great.
    - HillaryBriss 8y ago
      yeah. my point was not that bourbon oozes out the pores of the reused barrel. my point is that if the oak is the same species as that used in bourbon barrels, and if the barrel is charred in a manner similar to a bourbon barrel then the whisky flavor has a greater tendency toward bourbon-like flavor than if sherry or wine barrels or plain, un-charred oak barrels were used. bourbon barrel availability to scotch producers increased significantly after 1935 when US federal law required single use bourbon barrels, and, more so later in the 20th century when the supply of Spanish sherry barrels dwindled.
dluan 8y ago
IMO it seems the boom in various finishes is a response to NAS stuff being the norm and for producers to try and do something different with limited stock. I've had some wonderful wine finished whiskies - Leoville Barton Green Spot was amazing - and also some horrifying wine finished ones - Chateau Montelena Zinfandel Green Spot was hard to swallow. For some new producers like Kavalan or Amrut, whose almost entire lines are sherry, ex-bourbon, rum, and port finished casks, it seems like the way to make a dent in the market hype without having to have really good base whiskey. I'm just waiting for all that noise to be replaced by interesting woods - Quercus Garryana in the PNW of American whiskies is like the IPA of whiskey. Throw in some biology whizzes and the American craft whiskey market is going to be very interesting in the next 10 years.

tptacek 8y ago

I doubt there would be much difference between ex-rye and ex-bourbon. The first fill of American spirit strips most of the flavor out of the barrel and doesn’t leave really anything behind. (There’s a cool Woodford Reserve demo bottling you can get that demonstrates this).

HillaryBriss 8y ago
In Scotland, ex bourbon barrels go through a process of "rejuvenation" to expose flavor bearing compounds still found deeper in the wood: "... why not scrape out the inside of the cask and toast it again? After toasting the cask is charred anew, and voilà: You have a new, activated cask. ... A bourbon cask, used for 2 to 4 years in the USA, can be used for another 30 years in Scotland." https://www.whisky.com/information/knowledge/production/details/maturation-in-casks.html https://www.whisky.com/information/knowledge/production/deta...
- tptacek 8y ago
  Right, the casks still work, but it's not like aging scotch in William Larue Weller casks works any better than Jim Beam casks. It's just a source of oak.
  - dluan 8y ago
    Until someone tries this and shares a sample with me, I would bet that it would taste great.
  - HillaryBriss 8y ago
    yeah. my point was not that bourbon oozes out the pores of the reused barrel. my point is that if the oak is the same species as that used in bourbon barrels, and if the barrel is charred in a manner similar to a bourbon barrel then the whisky flavor has a greater tendency toward bourbon-like flavor than if sherry or wine barrels or plain, un-charred oak barrels were used. bourbon barrel availability to scotch producers increased significantly after 1935 when US federal law required single use bourbon barrels, and, more so later in the 20th century when the supply of Spanish sherry barrels dwindled.

dluan 8y ago

IMO it seems the boom in various finishes is a response to NAS stuff being the norm and for producers to try and do something different with limited stock. I've had some wonderful wine finished whiskies - Leoville Barton Green Spot was amazing - and also some horrifying wine finished ones - Chateau Montelena Zinfandel Green Spot was hard to swallow. For some new producers like Kavalan or Amrut, whose almost entire lines are sherry, ex-bourbon, rum, and port finished casks, it seems like the way to make a dent in the market hype without having to have really good base whiskey. I'm just waiting for all that noise to be replaced by interesting woods - Quercus Garryana in the PNW of American whiskies is like the IPA of whiskey. Throw in some biology whizzes and the American craft whiskey market is going to be very interesting in the next 10 years.