4 ms·

How do you scam as a buyer, when you have to pay the money beforehand? Are you talking about stolen cards?

by xfer 8y ago

maddyboo 8y ago
eBay/PayPal almost always sides with the buyer in disputes. It's relatively common for a buyer to purchase e.g. a DSLR and return it as "defective", mailing back a box of rocks to the seller.
- brian_cunnie 8y ago
  I beg to differ. In my experience (a small sample set of 1), Ebay sided with me, the seller, and not the buyer. A gentleman from Italy purchased an old book I was selling. He disputed the transaction, saying the book had never arrived; however, the Italian post said they had delivered the book. eBay sided with me. I kept the seller's money.
  - mehrdadn 8y ago
    I mean at that point when the post office agrees they had the package, they literally cannot logically blame you, because you could not have had any fault in this decision. What else were you supposed to do, fly over and hand it over to them in person? The onus can only logically be on the receiver to make sure they get the package the post office delivers, not on you. I understand the trouble starts when there's plausible deniability and no witness around. How do you prove they shipped rocks? How do they prove they didn't? At that point it really could be either person's fault, and their policy seems to be to blame it on the seller. That's what people mean when they say eBay "always" sides with the buyer. They don't mean that this is literally true even when it clearly doesn't make sense.
  - Double_a_92 8y ago
    What could the buyer do at that point if you had send him rocks?
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- adamqureshi 8y ago
  Yup. PP will freeze your whole transaction without notice if the buyer flags you for any reason without explanation and you can forget arbitration. Good Lucky.
pfisch 8y ago
You dispute the transaction and always win.
cellularmitosis 8y ago
"It arrived in broken condition, I want a refund", etc, I'd imagine.
NeedMoreTea 8y ago
Another commonly reported one is paying for an item by Paypal then collecting. Once you have the goods you report the item as undelivered[0]. eBay ask for proof of delivery that you can't supply, so automatically refund. Has been happening for years, but has become more prevalent recently. Last time I risked selling on eBay I spent a good part of the listing opting out of eBay Ts&Cs: Cash only, collection only, Paypal will be instantly refunded etc. Probably meant eBay could have cancelled the listing, but it worked. [0] https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/Seller-Central/Ebay-Paypal-Collection-scam/m-p/5894309 https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/Seller-Central/Ebay-Paypal-C... (INR=Item Not Received)
- voltagex_ 8y ago
  Proof of delivery? Registered mail or even tracking will do it (at least in Australia, dunno what Royal Mail give you). I can send a package that requires a signature at the other end.
  - NeedMoreTea 8y ago
    That's if you send it, when there's a few different services with proof of delivery and some with insurance. I was calling out when the buyer visits your house/premises and collects in person, then claims to eBay the item was not received.
    - Spivak 8y ago
      I'm not saying it should be this adversarial, but why not take a few photos with the buyer and the goods, them have them inspect the goods and sign a form with the date they received it and and a report on the condition? I wouldn't think it's that weird since anyone who's rented an apartment has to do the same.
- dboreham 8y ago
  Always ship with tracking, proof of receipt and insurance to cover the transaction value plus any out of pocket expenses.
anonymous5133 8y ago
"I never received the item" Then file a refund request. Ebay will eventually refund it if the seller can't provide a tracking. You can also spin it any number of other ways like if you get the item and the seller requests you to return the item then you just ship back a broken version.

How do you scam as a buyer, when you have to pay the money beforehand? Are you talking about stolen cards?

by xfer 8y ago

How do you scam as a buyer, when you have to pay the money beforehand? Are you talking about stolen cards?

eBay/PayPal almost always sides with the buyer in disputes. It's relatively common for a buyer to purchase e.g. a DSLR and return it as "defective", mailing back a box of rocks to the seller.

brian_cunnie 8y ago
I beg to differ. In my experience (a small sample set of 1), Ebay sided with me, the seller, and not the buyer. A gentleman from Italy purchased an old book I was selling. He disputed the transaction, saying the book had never arrived; however, the Italian post said they had delivered the book. eBay sided with me. I kept the seller's money.
- mehrdadn 8y ago
  I mean at that point when the post office agrees they had the package, they literally cannot logically blame you, because you could not have had any fault in this decision. What else were you supposed to do, fly over and hand it over to them in person? The onus can only logically be on the receiver to make sure they get the package the post office delivers, not on you. I understand the trouble starts when there's plausible deniability and no witness around. How do you prove they shipped rocks? How do they prove they didn't? At that point it really could be either person's fault, and their policy seems to be to blame it on the seller. That's what people mean when they say eBay "always" sides with the buyer. They don't mean that this is literally true even when it clearly doesn't make sense.
- Double_a_92 8y ago
  What could the buyer do at that point if you had send him rocks?
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
adamqureshi 8y ago
Yup. PP will freeze your whole transaction without notice if the buyer flags you for any reason without explanation and you can forget arbitration. Good Lucky.

pfisch 8y ago

You dispute the transaction and always win.

cellularmitosis 8y ago

"It arrived in broken condition, I want a refund", etc, I'd imagine.

NeedMoreTea 8y ago

Another commonly reported one is paying for an item by Paypal then collecting. Once you have the goods you report the item as undelivered[0]. eBay ask for proof of delivery that you can't supply, so automatically refund. Has been happening for years, but has become more prevalent recently. Last time I risked selling on eBay I spent a good part of the listing opting out of eBay Ts&Cs: Cash only, collection only, Paypal will be instantly refunded etc. Probably meant eBay could have cancelled the listing, but it worked. [0] https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/Seller-Central/Ebay-Paypal-Collection-scam/m-p/5894309 https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/Seller-Central/Ebay-Paypal-C... (INR=Item Not Received)

voltagex_ 8y ago
Proof of delivery? Registered mail or even tracking will do it (at least in Australia, dunno what Royal Mail give you). I can send a package that requires a signature at the other end.
- NeedMoreTea 8y ago
  That's if you send it, when there's a few different services with proof of delivery and some with insurance. I was calling out when the buyer visits your house/premises and collects in person, then claims to eBay the item was not received.
  - Spivak 8y ago
    I'm not saying it should be this adversarial, but why not take a few photos with the buyer and the goods, them have them inspect the goods and sign a form with the date they received it and and a report on the condition? I wouldn't think it's that weird since anyone who's rented an apartment has to do the same.
dboreham 8y ago
Always ship with tracking, proof of receipt and insurance to cover the transaction value plus any out of pocket expenses.

anonymous5133 8y ago

"I never received the item" Then file a refund request. Ebay will eventually refund it if the seller can't provide a tracking. You can also spin it any number of other ways like if you get the item and the seller requests you to return the item then you just ship back a broken version.