5 ms·

If you ever want to know why something sucks, just look at who is bribing politicians: https://www.opensecrets.org/lobby/top.php?indexType=s https://www.opense

If you ever want to know why something sucks, just look at who is bribing politicians: https://www.opensecrets.org/lobby/top.php?indexType=s https://www.opensecrets.org/lobby/top.php?indexType=s So here is the process it takes to get medicine that is legal in china. >Schedule appointment, talk to 1 person >Wait in the lobby, talk to 1 person and fill out government HIPPA + clinic paperwork >Go to back room, talk to nurse. Fill out paperwork >Wait >Talk to Physicians Assistant or Physician, get perscription >Pay office 120 dollars >forward perscription to pharmacy 1-2 people involved >Go to pharmacy >Talk to person at register >Pay Remember that in China, you just go to the store to buy 4$ amoxicillin. And despite the Physicians in the United States screaming about superbugs, China and Mexico both havent made superbugs despite not having massive regulations. This is a self made problem from corruption. The Medical profession milks the consumer because the consumer has no other option.

felix_nagaand 8y ago
Antibiotic resistant e.coli with mcr1 found in China. https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/superbug-resistant-to-last-resort-antibiotic-arises-in-china/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/superbug-resistan...
fma 8y ago
You're being downvoted probably because of the superbug statement...but my wife had surgery to remove a breast lump. It cost $3k and with all these appointments it happened over the course of 2 months. The cost does not include all these other scans and crap before. My cousin went to China (family visit). Lump was discovered here...surgery in China. Got seen in one day, surgery the next. $800. When my wife discovered a new lump...just doing follow up scans was $900. $500 for imaging center, $200 for the doctor at the imaging center...and $200 for her annual physical (they billed it as a problem visit and not an annual because she brought up the fact she has a lump, rather than the doctor finding it, even though breast cancer detection is part of annual!...still fighting, but I'll probably drop it because it's so stressful and time consuming)
- madengr 8y ago
  So that’s why I can’t be seen for a physical and problem at the same time. What a load of shit.
  - fma 8y ago
    Yeah...its all about the money. I have mild allergies in the spring that don't really bother me... Last year I did my appointment for my annual in the spring. Doctor goes, you have allergies. If I write you a prescription I gotta charge you as a problem visit. I recommend you try over the counter Claritan and if it doesn't help, come back. Now this doctor didn't own the practice, it's a decent size local franchise. Maybe that's their policy. But atleast the doctor told me up front. For my wife...we didn't know till we got the bill. Funny thing is the doctor signed paperwork that my wife did an annual (i get $$ from work if we do annuals)
cepth 8y ago
Of all the healthcare systems to negatively compare the US system to, I don't really think China is a good pick. Comparing the times that I've had to use medical care in China to my general experience in the US, I would opt for the latter every time. For a simple outpatient visit, I showed up to a well-regarded hospital, where I was greeted with a 2-hour wait, an overwhelmed front desk staff, and a session with a doctor that felt too rushed. For recurring mild headaches, the doctor prescribed medicine that a doctor in the US would have recommended only for migraines. I tossed that RX script in the trash as soon as I left the office. This was my first personal brush with the flip side of the easy access to drugs in China: the phenomenon of overprescription (https://www.healthaffairs.org/doi/full/10.1377/hlthaff.2010.0965 https://www.healthaffairs.org/doi/full/10.1377/hlthaff.2010.... & https://blogs.wsj.com/chinarealtime/2015/04/02/chinas-healthcare-system-plagued-by-unprofessional-doctors-researchers-say/ https://blogs.wsj.com/chinarealtime/2015/04/02/chinas-health...). If you've spent time in China (and it sounds like you may have), you've probably been exposed to the level of health supplement and "pharmaceutical" product marketing in China. It's prevalent on TV, on WeChat, and in newspapers. Supplements like "Nao Bai Jin", which is effectively just melatonin, get pushed on the public without government intervention. "Doctors" regularly appear on elaborate infomercials to promote supplements that claim to do everything from removing heavy metals from you blood to improving kidney function. All of these are available without a prescription. --- This is not to mention that if you're too poor to afford private health insurance in China (i.e. the vast majority of the population), you're stuck with the bare bones basic health insurance the government provides. For all the hysteria around Obamacare "death panels", it is actually the case in China that patients with terminal conditions are routinely sent home, since hospitals are so overcrowded (particularly in larger cities) and bed spaces are so limited. If the cost of drugs for a treatable disease or condition is too high, public insurance can refuse to pay for it outright. If it's political corruption you're worried about, keep in mind that the Chinese FDA is only getting a much-needed reorganization as an independent agency this year, and has seen scandals like this: https://foreignpolicy.com/2014/08/13/a-whistleblower-goes-public-against-chinas-fda/ https://foreignpolicy.com/2014/08/13/a-whistleblower-goes-pu.... This is not to mention that still fresh in many people's memories are the massive coverup of SARS in 2003, and a coverup of avian flu in 2013 (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/apr/03/china-reports-bird-flu-cases https://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/apr/03/china-reports-...). I'm no fan of administrative bloat, and it's somewhat ironic that access to drugs in China is in many ways more "free market" than in the US, but I don't think medical/pharma "corruption" is any less prevalent in China.
madhadron 8y ago
Your choice of amoxicilin is a very bad example. Antibiotics aren't tightly controlled enough. We need international treaties that prevent this kind of over the counter sale and countries required to track statistics of the prescription of antibiotics. The utter disregard of the commons that is the effectiveness of antibiotics makes me despair.

felix_nagaand 8y ago

Antibiotic resistant e.coli with mcr1 found in China. https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/superbug-resistant-to-last-resort-antibiotic-arises-in-china/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/superbug-resistan...

fma 8y ago

You're being downvoted probably because of the superbug statement...but my wife had surgery to remove a breast lump. It cost $3k and with all these appointments it happened over the course of 2 months. The cost does not include all these other scans and crap before. My cousin went to China (family visit). Lump was discovered here...surgery in China. Got seen in one day, surgery the next. $800. When my wife discovered a new lump...just doing follow up scans was $900. $500 for imaging center, $200 for the doctor at the imaging center...and $200 for her annual physical (they billed it as a problem visit and not an annual because she brought up the fact she has a lump, rather than the doctor finding it, even though breast cancer detection is part of annual!...still fighting, but I'll probably drop it because it's so stressful and time consuming)

madengr 8y ago
So that’s why I can’t be seen for a physical and problem at the same time. What a load of shit.
- fma 8y ago
  Yeah...its all about the money. I have mild allergies in the spring that don't really bother me... Last year I did my appointment for my annual in the spring. Doctor goes, you have allergies. If I write you a prescription I gotta charge you as a problem visit. I recommend you try over the counter Claritan and if it doesn't help, come back. Now this doctor didn't own the practice, it's a decent size local franchise. Maybe that's their policy. But atleast the doctor told me up front. For my wife...we didn't know till we got the bill. Funny thing is the doctor signed paperwork that my wife did an annual (i get $$ from work if we do annuals)

cepth 8y ago

Of all the healthcare systems to negatively compare the US system to, I don't really think China is a good pick. Comparing the times that I've had to use medical care in China to my general experience in the US, I would opt for the latter every time. For a simple outpatient visit, I showed up to a well-regarded hospital, where I was greeted with a 2-hour wait, an overwhelmed front desk staff, and a session with a doctor that felt too rushed. For recurring mild headaches, the doctor prescribed medicine that a doctor in the US would have recommended only for migraines. I tossed that RX script in the trash as soon as I left the office. This was my first personal brush with the flip side of the easy access to drugs in China: the phenomenon of overprescription (https://www.healthaffairs.org/doi/full/10.1377/hlthaff.2010.0965 https://www.healthaffairs.org/doi/full/10.1377/hlthaff.2010.... & https://blogs.wsj.com/chinarealtime/2015/04/02/chinas-healthcare-system-plagued-by-unprofessional-doctors-researchers-say/ https://blogs.wsj.com/chinarealtime/2015/04/02/chinas-health...). If you've spent time in China (and it sounds like you may have), you've probably been exposed to the level of health supplement and "pharmaceutical" product marketing in China. It's prevalent on TV, on WeChat, and in newspapers. Supplements like "Nao Bai Jin", which is effectively just melatonin, get pushed on the public without government intervention. "Doctors" regularly appear on elaborate infomercials to promote supplements that claim to do everything from removing heavy metals from you blood to improving kidney function. All of these are available without a prescription. --- This is not to mention that if you're too poor to afford private health insurance in China (i.e. the vast majority of the population), you're stuck with the bare bones basic health insurance the government provides. For all the hysteria around Obamacare "death panels", it is actually the case in China that patients with terminal conditions are routinely sent home, since hospitals are so overcrowded (particularly in larger cities) and bed spaces are so limited. If the cost of drugs for a treatable disease or condition is too high, public insurance can refuse to pay for it outright. If it's political corruption you're worried about, keep in mind that the Chinese FDA is only getting a much-needed reorganization as an independent agency this year, and has seen scandals like this: https://foreignpolicy.com/2014/08/13/a-whistleblower-goes-public-against-chinas-fda/ https://foreignpolicy.com/2014/08/13/a-whistleblower-goes-pu.... This is not to mention that still fresh in many people's memories are the massive coverup of SARS in 2003, and a coverup of avian flu in 2013 (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/apr/03/china-reports-bird-flu-cases https://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/apr/03/china-reports-...). I'm no fan of administrative bloat, and it's somewhat ironic that access to drugs in China is in many ways more "free market" than in the US, but I don't think medical/pharma "corruption" is any less prevalent in China.

madhadron 8y ago

Your choice of amoxicilin is a very bad example. Antibiotics aren't tightly controlled enough. We need international treaties that prevent this kind of over the counter sale and countries required to track statistics of the prescription of antibiotics. The utter disregard of the commons that is the effectiveness of antibiotics makes me despair.