3 ms·

Note that the GPS spoofing is Iran's claim, and has never been proved. I find it highly dubious, since for military aircraft the primary navigation device is an

Note that the GPS spoofing is Iran's claim, and has never been proved. I find it highly dubious, since for military aircraft the primary navigation device is an Inertial Navigation System (INS). If in the case of a large departure between INS and GPS data the drone chooses to rely only on GPS only, then it is grossly, almost negligently ill-designed for military operations. That said, GPS spoofing against civilian drones that do rely on GPS only has been consistently demonstrated and published in the literature, see https://doi.org/10.1002/rob.21513 https://doi.org/10.1002/rob.21513 or https://doi.org/10.1016/j.ifacol.2016.10.412 https://doi.org/10.1016/j.ifacol.2016.10.412 for interesting examples. Here's a demo video of the first paper: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qQXVUze8oE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6qQXVUze8oE

crankylinuxuser 8y ago
Again, relying purely on GPS and inertial sensors is foolhardy. There's 2 hemispheres we could navigate with: land, and stars. I know the old Minutemen missile controllers used a CCD and massive lens to do dead reckoning for steering. (Yes, a friend has a said minutemen missile controller board). But we need to get away from this 'lets rely on a tech that can be hacked'.
- JorgeGT 8y ago
  Didn't know about the Minuteman, but I know that the SR-71 featured an astroinertial navigation system that indeed used the stars for correcting the inertial data: https://timeandnavigation.si.edu/multimedia-asset/nortronics-nas-14v2-astroinertial-navigation-system https://timeandnavigation.si.edu/multimedia-asset/nortronics...
- Kadin 8y ago
  ICBMs and SLBMs use primarily inertial navigation (with a starting position provided from the launch facility); the stellar navigation systems correct it by adding a mid-course position fix. I do not know for sure, but I would be willing to bet, that the missiles are capable of reaching their target with reasonable accuracy in the absence of the mid-course stellar fix, since in a nuclear war with enough exo-atmospheric detonations, it might not be possible to visualize the fixed stars at the right time (and a requirement to do this would be an obvious vulnerability for a missile defense system, e.g. you could hit the missile with a laser from a space platform at the right moment and spoof the stellar nav system).
Kadin 8y ago
Agreed and the more informed speculation about the RQ-170 that I have read is very skeptical of the Iranian GPS-spoofing story. The RQ-170 supposedly has at least doubly-redundant, possibly triply-redundant, position-fixing systems, and it seems nearly impossible that GPS failure or spoofing wouldn't have been anticipated in the design. Some have suggested that the aircraft might have crashed for other reasons and been recovered by Iran, and the GPS spoofing story is propaganda on their part in order to explain how they came into possession of it. I suspect we will not know the real story until all the documents are declassified at some point in the future. http://aviationintel.com/iran-says-it-spoofed-the-rq-170-sentinel-into-thinking-it-was-home-others-say-it-was-captured-in-afghanistan/ http://aviationintel.com/iran-says-it-spoofed-the-rq-170-sen...

crankylinuxuser 8y ago

Again, relying purely on GPS and inertial sensors is foolhardy. There's 2 hemispheres we could navigate with: land, and stars. I know the old Minutemen missile controllers used a CCD and massive lens to do dead reckoning for steering. (Yes, a friend has a said minutemen missile controller board). But we need to get away from this 'lets rely on a tech that can be hacked'.

JorgeGT 8y ago
Didn't know about the Minuteman, but I know that the SR-71 featured an astroinertial navigation system that indeed used the stars for correcting the inertial data: https://timeandnavigation.si.edu/multimedia-asset/nortronics-nas-14v2-astroinertial-navigation-system https://timeandnavigation.si.edu/multimedia-asset/nortronics...
Kadin 8y ago
ICBMs and SLBMs use primarily inertial navigation (with a starting position provided from the launch facility); the stellar navigation systems correct it by adding a mid-course position fix. I do not know for sure, but I would be willing to bet, that the missiles are capable of reaching their target with reasonable accuracy in the absence of the mid-course stellar fix, since in a nuclear war with enough exo-atmospheric detonations, it might not be possible to visualize the fixed stars at the right time (and a requirement to do this would be an obvious vulnerability for a missile defense system, e.g. you could hit the missile with a laser from a space platform at the right moment and spoof the stellar nav system).

Kadin 8y ago

Agreed and the more informed speculation about the RQ-170 that I have read is very skeptical of the Iranian GPS-spoofing story. The RQ-170 supposedly has at least doubly-redundant, possibly triply-redundant, position-fixing systems, and it seems nearly impossible that GPS failure or spoofing wouldn't have been anticipated in the design. Some have suggested that the aircraft might have crashed for other reasons and been recovered by Iran, and the GPS spoofing story is propaganda on their part in order to explain how they came into possession of it. I suspect we will not know the real story until all the documents are declassified at some point in the future. http://aviationintel.com/iran-says-it-spoofed-the-rq-170-sentinel-into-thinking-it-was-home-others-say-it-was-captured-in-afghanistan/ http://aviationintel.com/iran-says-it-spoofed-the-rq-170-sen...