3 ms·

I hadn't heard of FizzBuzz, but tried it out a moment ago. How is possible for someone with a rudimentary understanding of programming to be unable to solve th

I hadn't heard of FizzBuzz, but tried it out a moment ago. How is possible for someone with a rudimentary understanding of programming to be unable to solve this in a couple of minutes?

jrockway 16y ago
It's not. The problem with the world of professional programming is that there are a lot of people claiming to be programmers that aren't. The reason why people can code-monkey their PHP scripts but not solve FizzBuzz is because of an iterative process. When you are hacking some web page, you just change stuff until it works. You try again and again and again and eventually you're right. With FizzBuzz, you have to think about a couple things before you answer. It's so simple that you have to get it right the first time; you're supposed to think, then program. But most people are not in the habit of thinking, and just skip right to the press buttons while staring at the blinky cursor stage. Then they fail the FizzBuzz interview.
- raganwald 16y ago
  Thank you, this is very insightful, this idea that some problems are amenable to just trying things and some problems require thought before starting.
Groxx 16y ago
The one I was referring to (and apparently others, though they 'solved' it) didn't know about modulo. Which would certainly make it harder, though it's ridiculously fundamental. They worked for about 20 minutes writing out something to do with a 101-element array and decimal arithmetic to initialize it (without using ceil / floor to compare, thus mimicking a mod function) before they admitted they were stuck. This applicant was a graduate of some fairly high ranked university, though I don't know which one. They can come from anywhere.
- danilocampos 16y ago
  Wow. Well, thanks for the FizzBuzz discussion. This self-taught programmer feels just a little less like a bozo. There's hope for me yet!
- Tamerlin 16y ago
  That's even worse than the CS student (she had a bachelor's degree in CS, and was in the final year of her master's degree program in CS)... she actually attempted to delete an object in C++ by calling its destructor directly. Needless to say, my company didn't try to keep her when Booz Allen Hamilton recruited her away from us.
Riesling 16y ago
To be fair, for some people solving cognitive tasks under pressure is absolutely impossible. I just wrote a FizzBuzz solving script in python in about two minutes sitting on the couch drinking wine, while the tv is running in the background. But I guarantee you that I would mess it up in an interview situation. Under extreme stress, I do not have the ability to think straight. It's almost as if my mind goes into survival mode, allowing only basic operations in order to ensure a fast reaction time.
- awakeasleep 16y ago
  Ha you're right about that. I heard that our brain can only hold a certain amount of blood, and that blood carries the sugar that fuels it. So when you're scared, and blood is pumping to your amygdala, your frontal lobes have less fuel to make decisions. Do you program for your day job? I do and I've found I'm under that sort of stress consistently, and with harder problems to solve. I guess it does affect me but I've been working on my 'not caring' skills to compensate.

I hadn't heard of FizzBuzz, but tried it out a moment ago. How is possible for someone with a rudimentary understanding of programming to be unable to solve this in a couple of minutes?

jrockway 16y ago

It's not. The problem with the world of professional programming is that there are a lot of people claiming to be programmers that aren't. The reason why people can code-monkey their PHP scripts but not solve FizzBuzz is because of an iterative process. When you are hacking some web page, you just change stuff until it works. You try again and again and again and eventually you're right. With FizzBuzz, you have to think about a couple things before you answer. It's so simple that you have to get it right the first time; you're supposed to think, then program. But most people are not in the habit of thinking, and just skip right to the press buttons while staring at the blinky cursor stage. Then they fail the FizzBuzz interview.

raganwald 16y ago
Thank you, this is very insightful, this idea that some problems are amenable to just trying things and some problems require thought before starting.

Groxx 16y ago

The one I was referring to (and apparently others, though they 'solved' it) didn't know about modulo. Which would certainly make it harder, though it's ridiculously fundamental. They worked for about 20 minutes writing out something to do with a 101-element array and decimal arithmetic to initialize it (without using ceil / floor to compare, thus mimicking a mod function) before they admitted they were stuck. This applicant was a graduate of some fairly high ranked university, though I don't know which one. They can come from anywhere.

danilocampos 16y ago
Wow. Well, thanks for the FizzBuzz discussion. This self-taught programmer feels just a little less like a bozo. There's hope for me yet!
Tamerlin 16y ago
That's even worse than the CS student (she had a bachelor's degree in CS, and was in the final year of her master's degree program in CS)... she actually attempted to delete an object in C++ by calling its destructor directly. Needless to say, my company didn't try to keep her when Booz Allen Hamilton recruited her away from us.

Riesling 16y ago

To be fair, for some people solving cognitive tasks under pressure is absolutely impossible. I just wrote a FizzBuzz solving script in python in about two minutes sitting on the couch drinking wine, while the tv is running in the background. But I guarantee you that I would mess it up in an interview situation. Under extreme stress, I do not have the ability to think straight. It's almost as if my mind goes into survival mode, allowing only basic operations in order to ensure a fast reaction time.

awakeasleep 16y ago
Ha you're right about that. I heard that our brain can only hold a certain amount of blood, and that blood carries the sugar that fuels it. So when you're scared, and blood is pumping to your amygdala, your frontal lobes have less fuel to make decisions. Do you program for your day job? I do and I've found I'm under that sort of stress consistently, and with harder problems to solve. I guess it does affect me but I've been working on my 'not caring' skills to compensate.