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So this is a reproducible research application suite built on Node.JS, the epitome of non-reproducibility and characterised by fast pace, little care for compat

by gkya 8y ago

So this is a reproducible research application suite built on Node.JS, the epitome of non-reproducibility and characterised by fast pace, little care for compatibility, and an ecosystem of volatile libraries?

sghiassy 8y ago
Also the most widely used language 6 years in a row: https://insights.stackoverflow.com/survey/2018/#most-popular-technologies https://insights.stackoverflow.com/survey/2018/#most-popular...
- techphys_91 8y ago
  That by itself doesn't count for much in this context. Web based technologies tend to move quickly while scientists are almost all using math libraries that were written in the 60/ 70's. To scientists these things are just tools and they prefer stability, reproducibility and minimal dependencies over using what's popular.
  - sghiassy 8y ago
    I doubt there’s much that can be said her to sway anyone’s mind. Either way, wish the project luck! Reproducible scientific studies is paramount.
    - gkya 8y ago
      Not really. Reproducible research depends on reproducible execution, which depends on a reproducible environment, which depends on a reproducible set of libraries and frameworks. I don't think Node is apt for that. The community values new over stable, and cool over technically superior. That might have its value, but I do not believe those are valuable traits for a project of this sorts. That it's popular means nothing. Windows is the most popular operating system, pop is the most popular genre of music, oil is the most popular fuel, since decades. This doesn't invalidate their utility or our appreciation of them, but it does not mean they're good for everything.
      - sghiassy 8y ago
        Uh, sure (eyeroll)
nokome 8y ago
Hi, Stencila dev here, thanks for the feedback. There are several modular components that make up Stencila. The user interface modules are indeed built using Javascript, and Node.js is used in a number of places including the desktop and CLI apps and format converters. But for code execution, Stencila does not rely on Node, and users can use R, or Python or SQL. > Reproducible research depends on reproducible execution, which depends on a reproducible environment, which depends on a reproducible set of libraries and frameworks. Completely agree. We are trying to make it easy for people to use reproducible libraries and environments. To this end, we are developing Nix environments (a highly reproducible way of defining computing environments) which include Stencila "execution contexts" for R, Python etc with standard libraries included. These environments can be connected to the user interface. See https://github.com/stencila/images/ https://github.com/stencila/images/ for more details.
- gkya 8y ago
  Thanks for the explanations!

by gkya 8y ago

sghiassy 8y ago

Also the most widely used language 6 years in a row: https://insights.stackoverflow.com/survey/2018/#most-popular-technologies https://insights.stackoverflow.com/survey/2018/#most-popular...

techphys_91 8y ago
That by itself doesn't count for much in this context. Web based technologies tend to move quickly while scientists are almost all using math libraries that were written in the 60/ 70's. To scientists these things are just tools and they prefer stability, reproducibility and minimal dependencies over using what's popular.
- sghiassy 8y ago
  I doubt there’s much that can be said her to sway anyone’s mind. Either way, wish the project luck! Reproducible scientific studies is paramount.
  - gkya 8y ago
    Not really. Reproducible research depends on reproducible execution, which depends on a reproducible environment, which depends on a reproducible set of libraries and frameworks. I don't think Node is apt for that. The community values new over stable, and cool over technically superior. That might have its value, but I do not believe those are valuable traits for a project of this sorts. That it's popular means nothing. Windows is the most popular operating system, pop is the most popular genre of music, oil is the most popular fuel, since decades. This doesn't invalidate their utility or our appreciation of them, but it does not mean they're good for everything.
    - sghiassy 8y ago
      Uh, sure (eyeroll)

nokome 8y ago

Hi, Stencila dev here, thanks for the feedback. There are several modular components that make up Stencila. The user interface modules are indeed built using Javascript, and Node.js is used in a number of places including the desktop and CLI apps and format converters. But for code execution, Stencila does not rely on Node, and users can use R, or Python or SQL. > Reproducible research depends on reproducible execution, which depends on a reproducible environment, which depends on a reproducible set of libraries and frameworks. Completely agree. We are trying to make it easy for people to use reproducible libraries and environments. To this end, we are developing Nix environments (a highly reproducible way of defining computing environments) which include Stencila "execution contexts" for R, Python etc with standard libraries included. These environments can be connected to the user interface. See https://github.com/stencila/images/ https://github.com/stencila/images/ for more details.

gkya 8y ago
Thanks for the explanations!