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My favorite euphemism for those tasks is "shaving the yak". https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/yak_shaving https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/yak_shaving

allannienhuis 8y ago
shaving the yak refers to tasks that don't really need to be done. The parent was talking about mundane tasks that really do need to be done by someone, so you put up with it as just part of the job.
- kornish 8y ago
  Really? The linked definition is: "Any apparently useless activity which, by allowing you to overcome intermediate difficulties, allows you to solve a larger problem." That sounds like necessary mundane tasks to me. Definitely mostly hear it used that way.
  - SilasX 8y ago
    There are subtleties in how the term "yak shaving" is used that aren't quite captured by that definition. I wouldn't call it yak shaving to review a help file for accuracy. My characteristic example of yak shaving would be, "I want to add a radio button (mutually exclusive pick-one option) to this form, but the framework's docs don't say how, so I'll implement it with the checkbox list and require only one to be checked, so I look up how to enforce input validation, but that requires installing an extra module in the build, which then installs a different version of one dependency we're already using, which the framework doesn't like, so I need to install another extension that lets you use two different versions of the same library in the build, but has an occasional bug..." Those steps are necessary in the sense that the current system forces you to do them, but (like technical debt), they're completely artificial steps that shouldn't be necessary (in that sense) to begin with.
    - kornish 8y ago
      Fair! Good example.
    - allannienhuis 8y ago
      right, and I thought the implication is that at some point in that process we really should be unwinding the stack and fixing/resetting some assumption that will let us move ahead in a more efficient manner. So in that sense I've always thought of it as being in an undesirable state (like a code smell), not a necessary one.
    - philwelch 8y ago
      Or at least it's a rigamarole. For a folk etymology, I like to imagine that I'm making a costume for a costume party, and I need a fake mustache or something, and I can't find one anywhere so I look up how they're made, and it turns out most fake facial hair appliances are made from yak hair, but I can't find a supplier for yak hair anywhere, which is why my quest to dress up as Fu Manchu or Mr. Spock for Halloween has led me to a yak ranch 90 minutes out of town patiently explaining to a bemused yak rancher why I'm standing around his pasture with a straight razor. "I need to shave a yak," I explain. "That's the only way I can get yak hair." I'm in a deeply absurd situation, purely as a consequence of perfectly normal and understandable desires that just got completely out of control. I take in a deep breath, the smells of fresh air and yak manure and whatever the hell they feed yaks, gazing upon miles upon miles of gently rolling hills before rugged mountain peaks in the distance, awkwardly shaking my can of shaving cream. The rancher squints at me. I imagine him as an old man, his face weathered and wrinked, wearing suspenders and a red flannel shirt. "Why do you need yak hair?", he asks. I sigh. "It's a long story."
  - kolpa 8y ago
    "Yak shaving" is for things that seem ridiculous at first glance but turn out to be necessary or optimal due to unexpected constraints and requirement -- washing your car requires you to shave a yak to get the wool to build a sponge. "Tying your shoes" is for mundane but necessary tasks. "Sharpening your saw" is for tangential work that indirectly makes your output better.
  - allannienhuis 8y ago
    hmm, I've understood the term used to describe situations where people wind up wasting time doing things that seem important at the time (ie shaving the yak to get the wool to make the sponge to wash the car), but are really unnecessary - you should have just bought a sponge at the store and got on with washing the car...
- kashyapc 8y ago
  Yes, preceisly what allanienhuis says above. The Chimney Sweep taks are important, but mundane. E.g. some (a lot of) people dislike bug triage, but it's damn important. I like triaging (and fixing) bugs. To a decent extent, a bug report means something is bothering a real user. Fixing that is more rewarding (than writing features that might be useful for someone). Edit: Just noticed SilasX below has a fuller example of 'yak shaving'. Thanks.

allannienhuis 8y ago

shaving the yak refers to tasks that don't really need to be done. The parent was talking about mundane tasks that really do need to be done by someone, so you put up with it as just part of the job.

kornish 8y ago
Really? The linked definition is: "Any apparently useless activity which, by allowing you to overcome intermediate difficulties, allows you to solve a larger problem." That sounds like necessary mundane tasks to me. Definitely mostly hear it used that way.
- SilasX 8y ago
  There are subtleties in how the term "yak shaving" is used that aren't quite captured by that definition. I wouldn't call it yak shaving to review a help file for accuracy. My characteristic example of yak shaving would be, "I want to add a radio button (mutually exclusive pick-one option) to this form, but the framework's docs don't say how, so I'll implement it with the checkbox list and require only one to be checked, so I look up how to enforce input validation, but that requires installing an extra module in the build, which then installs a different version of one dependency we're already using, which the framework doesn't like, so I need to install another extension that lets you use two different versions of the same library in the build, but has an occasional bug..." Those steps are necessary in the sense that the current system forces you to do them, but (like technical debt), they're completely artificial steps that shouldn't be necessary (in that sense) to begin with.
  - kornish 8y ago
    Fair! Good example.
  - allannienhuis 8y ago
    right, and I thought the implication is that at some point in that process we really should be unwinding the stack and fixing/resetting some assumption that will let us move ahead in a more efficient manner. So in that sense I've always thought of it as being in an undesirable state (like a code smell), not a necessary one.
  - philwelch 8y ago
    Or at least it's a rigamarole. For a folk etymology, I like to imagine that I'm making a costume for a costume party, and I need a fake mustache or something, and I can't find one anywhere so I look up how they're made, and it turns out most fake facial hair appliances are made from yak hair, but I can't find a supplier for yak hair anywhere, which is why my quest to dress up as Fu Manchu or Mr. Spock for Halloween has led me to a yak ranch 90 minutes out of town patiently explaining to a bemused yak rancher why I'm standing around his pasture with a straight razor. "I need to shave a yak," I explain. "That's the only way I can get yak hair." I'm in a deeply absurd situation, purely as a consequence of perfectly normal and understandable desires that just got completely out of control. I take in a deep breath, the smells of fresh air and yak manure and whatever the hell they feed yaks, gazing upon miles upon miles of gently rolling hills before rugged mountain peaks in the distance, awkwardly shaking my can of shaving cream. The rancher squints at me. I imagine him as an old man, his face weathered and wrinked, wearing suspenders and a red flannel shirt. "Why do you need yak hair?", he asks. I sigh. "It's a long story."
- kolpa 8y ago
  "Yak shaving" is for things that seem ridiculous at first glance but turn out to be necessary or optimal due to unexpected constraints and requirement -- washing your car requires you to shave a yak to get the wool to build a sponge. "Tying your shoes" is for mundane but necessary tasks. "Sharpening your saw" is for tangential work that indirectly makes your output better.
- allannienhuis 8y ago
  hmm, I've understood the term used to describe situations where people wind up wasting time doing things that seem important at the time (ie shaving the yak to get the wool to make the sponge to wash the car), but are really unnecessary - you should have just bought a sponge at the store and got on with washing the car...
kashyapc 8y ago
Yes, preceisly what allanienhuis says above. The Chimney Sweep taks are important, but mundane. E.g. some (a lot of) people dislike bug triage, but it's damn important. I like triaging (and fixing) bugs. To a decent extent, a bug report means something is bothering a real user. Fixing that is more rewarding (than writing features that might be useful for someone). Edit: Just noticed SilasX below has a fuller example of 'yak shaving'. Thanks.