4 ms·

In my tiny little part of the world it would take me 3 1/2 hours to drive 328km to Halifax. Or pay anywhere from $500 to $900 to fly the 180km as-the-crow-flie

In my tiny little part of the world it would take me 3 1/2 hours to drive 328km to Halifax. Or pay anywhere from $500 to $900 to fly the 180km as-the-crow-flies distance for a few minutes in the air. One flight flies 1,300km the wrong way then back, two connections, a a layover and then to Halifax for $1,100.

sokoloff 8y ago
Ever considered learning to fly and flying it? Have any friends with airplanes that can drop you off?
- cm2012 8y ago
  Flying private airplanes is probably the most dangerous common thing you can do.
  - namibj 8y ago
    Are there any small enough for the one-parachute-for-plane-and-contents technology that can go closer to the speed of sound (like, go about Mach .8 or so), and rely on pulling into stall to slow down enough for the parachute to deploy without ripping out it's part of the airframe? That should be much safer than the current way when operating small aircraft at speeds where that parachute could not deploy directly.
    - dlgeek 8y ago
      So, they're not nearly as fast as you're describing, but Cirrus does have parachutes on a lot of it's planes: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cirrus_Airframe_Parachute_System https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cirrus_Airframe_Parachute_Syst...
      - namibj 8y ago
        I know, the issue there is that if you deploy a parachute at over about Mach 0.4~0.5, you will either rip the airframe apart or reduce survival chances of large vertebrae due to the massive acceleration. The solution there would be going into a stall, as that usually serves to provide the drag needed to slow down to safe parachute speeds, but not so much that the airframe can't be reasonably build strong enough to not suffer damage that matters if one considers the plane scrap metal once it lands with the parachute. This is just too slow to get the main benefit of air travel, which is being able to go at barely subsonic speeds without handling being a massive headache. Of course you will have worse handling at barely subsonic speeds, due to any large deflection going transsonic and having the potential to result in loss of control. But that can easily be handled electronically, especially if the plane is at least somewhat aerodynamically stable, i.e. won't require constant corrections to not go into stall (like some modern fighter jets do).
        sokoloff 8y ago
        If you only have to go a couple hundred miles, the cruise speed isn't a significant factor to the overall trip time. Let the airlines handle the 1000+ mile trips (with all the associated hassles); slower airplanes don't give up near as much time on short legs. Door to door, I can beat the airlines on most trips under 1000 miles. I don't need to get to the airport 90 minutes ahead of departure, go through security, wait for boarding to complete, wait for pushback, connect through a hub, wait for bags, and can often land at an airport closer to where I want to be and have a rental car or cab waiting. The fact that cruise speed is only 215 mph/350 kph is made up for by all the slippage inherent in airline travel.
        namibj 8y ago
        Yes, the one thing missing that would be being able to start from a normal road, and land on something similar, which could allow pretty much door-to-door is too hard to make work for how many could afford it.
        sokoloff 8y ago
        In Alaska, Montana, Idaho, North Dakota, and South Dakota, it's legal to land on rural roads. Even in places where you can't land on roads, there are WAY more airports than you probably think in the US. It's about 19K, with a little over 5K of those being public use. (Even the private ones are often accessible with just a coordinating phone call.) Of those, fewer than 400 are "Primary" airports (defined as having scheduled commercial service and more than 10K enplanements [commercial passengers outbound] per year).
  - eesmith 8y ago
    I believe that motorcycling might be more dangerous. Compare https://aviation.stackexchange.com/questions/198/how-dangerous-is-flying-in-a-single-engine-plane https://aviation.stackexchange.com/questions/198/how-dangero... where depending on the definition you use, "Private aircraft have a fatality rate about 19 times greater than driving" and 'General Aviation has "about one-sixth as many accidents on a per-vehicle-mile basis" compared to driving.' while http://www.iihs.org/iihs/topics/t/motorcycles/fatalityfacts/motorcycles http://www.iihs.org/iihs/topics/t/motorcycles/fatalityfacts/... says "the number of deaths on motorcycles was nearly 29 times the number in cars. " 29x (motorcycles) > 19x (general aviation).
- lostlogin 8y ago
  This comment is amazing. Is it a ‘yes’ for you? Would that be common anywhere?
  - fragmede 8y ago
    Yes - Alaska. Urban legend is there are more pilots per capita than licensed drivers.
    - DoreenMichele 8y ago
      I don't know about that stat, but: Alaska has six times as many pilots and 16 times as many aircraft per capita as the rest of the nation. https://m.facebook.com/alaskapilot/photos/a.427738310641446.1073741825.182696548478958/427738313974779/?type=3 https://m.facebook.com/alaskapilot/photos/a.427738310641446.... (I've seen the 6x as many pilots stay previously. This is the first thing I found that repeated it. /lazy cite)
- CrazyCatDog 8y ago
  This would have been my reply 5 years ago—when I lived in California. Winter flying in Halifax or anywhere with seasons is not particularly safe, nor practical (ice wrecks havoc on small planes)
  - sokoloff 8y ago
    Fair point, though on bad winter weather days, a 3.5 hour drive is still a viable option. (Flying on clear winter days is great; airplanes love the cold weather.)
- dingaling 8y ago
  Learning to fly in the USA costs about $10k to $15k. Then about $200 per hour for actually flying the aircraft ( fuel, hire, insurance, airport fees ) so about $600 for that return trip. I guess the maths might work for very frequent trips or if he could take a passenger who would split the costs.
- dghughes 8y ago
  I've taken flying lessons but it's been 25 years since I've done it. The cost even back then was crazy something like $150/hour. I took off and landed all with an instructor not solo. The instructor also pointed out one day a giant purple balloon I would probably have run into if not for him pointing it out. And barfing, lots of barfing.

sokoloff 8y ago

Ever considered learning to fly and flying it? Have any friends with airplanes that can drop you off?

cm2012 8y ago
Flying private airplanes is probably the most dangerous common thing you can do.
- namibj 8y ago
  Are there any small enough for the one-parachute-for-plane-and-contents technology that can go closer to the speed of sound (like, go about Mach .8 or so), and rely on pulling into stall to slow down enough for the parachute to deploy without ripping out it's part of the airframe? That should be much safer than the current way when operating small aircraft at speeds where that parachute could not deploy directly.
  - dlgeek 8y ago
    So, they're not nearly as fast as you're describing, but Cirrus does have parachutes on a lot of it's planes: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cirrus_Airframe_Parachute_System https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cirrus_Airframe_Parachute_Syst...
    - namibj 8y ago
      I know, the issue there is that if you deploy a parachute at over about Mach 0.4~0.5, you will either rip the airframe apart or reduce survival chances of large vertebrae due to the massive acceleration. The solution there would be going into a stall, as that usually serves to provide the drag needed to slow down to safe parachute speeds, but not so much that the airframe can't be reasonably build strong enough to not suffer damage that matters if one considers the plane scrap metal once it lands with the parachute. This is just too slow to get the main benefit of air travel, which is being able to go at barely subsonic speeds without handling being a massive headache. Of course you will have worse handling at barely subsonic speeds, due to any large deflection going transsonic and having the potential to result in loss of control. But that can easily be handled electronically, especially if the plane is at least somewhat aerodynamically stable, i.e. won't require constant corrections to not go into stall (like some modern fighter jets do).
      - sokoloff 8y ago
        If you only have to go a couple hundred miles, the cruise speed isn't a significant factor to the overall trip time. Let the airlines handle the 1000+ mile trips (with all the associated hassles); slower airplanes don't give up near as much time on short legs. Door to door, I can beat the airlines on most trips under 1000 miles. I don't need to get to the airport 90 minutes ahead of departure, go through security, wait for boarding to complete, wait for pushback, connect through a hub, wait for bags, and can often land at an airport closer to where I want to be and have a rental car or cab waiting. The fact that cruise speed is only 215 mph/350 kph is made up for by all the slippage inherent in airline travel.
        namibj 8y ago
        Yes, the one thing missing that would be being able to start from a normal road, and land on something similar, which could allow pretty much door-to-door is too hard to make work for how many could afford it.
        sokoloff 8y ago
        In Alaska, Montana, Idaho, North Dakota, and South Dakota, it's legal to land on rural roads. Even in places where you can't land on roads, there are WAY more airports than you probably think in the US. It's about 19K, with a little over 5K of those being public use. (Even the private ones are often accessible with just a coordinating phone call.) Of those, fewer than 400 are "Primary" airports (defined as having scheduled commercial service and more than 10K enplanements [commercial passengers outbound] per year).
- eesmith 8y ago
  I believe that motorcycling might be more dangerous. Compare https://aviation.stackexchange.com/questions/198/how-dangerous-is-flying-in-a-single-engine-plane https://aviation.stackexchange.com/questions/198/how-dangero... where depending on the definition you use, "Private aircraft have a fatality rate about 19 times greater than driving" and 'General Aviation has "about one-sixth as many accidents on a per-vehicle-mile basis" compared to driving.' while http://www.iihs.org/iihs/topics/t/motorcycles/fatalityfacts/motorcycles http://www.iihs.org/iihs/topics/t/motorcycles/fatalityfacts/... says "the number of deaths on motorcycles was nearly 29 times the number in cars. " 29x (motorcycles) > 19x (general aviation).
lostlogin 8y ago
This comment is amazing. Is it a ‘yes’ for you? Would that be common anywhere?
- fragmede 8y ago
  Yes - Alaska. Urban legend is there are more pilots per capita than licensed drivers.
  - DoreenMichele 8y ago
    I don't know about that stat, but: Alaska has six times as many pilots and 16 times as many aircraft per capita as the rest of the nation. https://m.facebook.com/alaskapilot/photos/a.427738310641446.1073741825.182696548478958/427738313974779/?type=3 https://m.facebook.com/alaskapilot/photos/a.427738310641446.... (I've seen the 6x as many pilots stay previously. This is the first thing I found that repeated it. /lazy cite)
CrazyCatDog 8y ago
This would have been my reply 5 years ago—when I lived in California. Winter flying in Halifax or anywhere with seasons is not particularly safe, nor practical (ice wrecks havoc on small planes)
- sokoloff 8y ago
  Fair point, though on bad winter weather days, a 3.5 hour drive is still a viable option. (Flying on clear winter days is great; airplanes love the cold weather.)
dingaling 8y ago
Learning to fly in the USA costs about $10k to $15k. Then about $200 per hour for actually flying the aircraft ( fuel, hire, insurance, airport fees ) so about $600 for that return trip. I guess the maths might work for very frequent trips or if he could take a passenger who would split the costs.
dghughes 8y ago
I've taken flying lessons but it's been 25 years since I've done it. The cost even back then was crazy something like $150/hour. I took off and landed all with an instructor not solo. The instructor also pointed out one day a giant purple balloon I would probably have run into if not for him pointing it out. And barfing, lots of barfing.