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There have been plenty of news articles in the last two days about the current administration forming a task force to remove citizenship from naturalized citize

There have been plenty of news articles in the last two days about the current administration forming a task force to remove citizenship from naturalized citizens that they believe lied on their applications. That's citizens, not just permanent residents. The immigration process is long and complicated. It would be easy to make small mistakes here and there. Technically, some of those mistakes could get you deported.

EduardoBautista 8y ago
That has always been a possibility. Nothing new with this administration.
jexah 8y ago
> remove citizenship from naturalized citizens that they believe lied on their applications If the individual was given citizenship on the basis of those lies, then it makes total sense to revoke citizenship. That would be like hiring a developer who says he is an amazing programmer who can solve any problem. Turns out after he got the job, not only is he terrible at programming, but he's also a liar. So you fire him. If you lie on an application for something, and you are awarded, generally speaking it makes sense to revoke the award if it is discovered that you lied.
- PaulAJ 8y ago
  On the other hand, what if you say, for instance, that you got your degree in '93, but actually it was '92? The trouble with the law is that it doesn't distinguish between whoppers, fibs and clerical errors. They are all falsehoods, and all are grounds for deportation if the government decides it wants you out of the country.
  - jexah 8y ago
    I assume you meant to say "you claimed you got your degree in 93 when you actually got it in 92". I work in the background check business and each check has its own windows of acceptance. Depending on how long ago the degree was awarded, the window can vary from 0 years to 10+ years. This is also contextual, as if the immigration application was submitted in 93, and you say you got your degree in 92, when you actually got it in 94, and your immigration was approved in 95. This is a clear case of an invalid application. Having said that, I'd like to see an example of deportation on the grounds of a 1 year mistake in the year one had received their degree, when the degree was received 30 years prior to application. I would like to see it not because I'd agree with such a measure, but because it would give you a strong case. As it stands I don't believe that anything close to that has happened.
- ninedays 8y ago
  If I continue the logic of your reasonning, the employer should have a technical test the candidate needs to perform in order for the employer to ensure that the candidate is not simply lying about his competences. If the employer gives the test, the employer hires him because he succeeded, then it is more the employer fault to hire him in the first place, not the employee fault because he performed the test. The moment a person becomes a citizen of a country, he is entitled to the exact same right that the citizen next to him. There is no distinction of a citizen who was born in the country vs a citizen that was naturalized. In your case, if someone profits from a lie, then we correct the process so that people cannot profit from it anymoreinstead of revoking things you gave by mistake (things _you_ gave by _your_ mistake). If you hire someone without checking that what they say is true, then I am sorry but you're just stupid. If a country give citizenship to people without verifying that what is written in the application is true, then I think the process is incredibly stupid.
  - jexah 8y ago
    Okay let's just spend trillions of dollars giving every person who has applied for immigration complete background checks, and if any of the checks can't be completed for any reason what-so-ever, we should deny them citizenship. Sounds like a plan, Stan. That, or we just deny everybody because we can't afford it. Employers can afford to vet their employees. The state cannot afford to vet any regular citizenship application to the same degree. If we could, that'd be great. This is why it makes sense to assume the best in people (like we do), and if it turns out they intentionally lied or mislead on their application, then revoke the awards that were provided based on that misinformation.
bmelton 8y ago
Not to repeat myself, but this is similar to an action taken by the Obama administration. https://www.cnn.com/2016/09/19/politics/us-citizens-deported-report-fingerprints/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2016/09/19/politics/us-citizens-deported...
jonhohle 8y ago
I have sponsored an immigrant (have you?) who is now a citizen. If they were at even minimal risk of losing their citizenship, it would be horrifying. Since the articles referenced involve fraud on immigration applications, I’m sure there is zero percent risk of deportation in my case. Fraud requires intent. It’s not making a small mistake here and there on an application (been there, done that, fixed it, process goes on).
- deanmoriarty 8y ago
  Once again, this is a quote where a small "mistake" (if you can call it that) caused a visa holder already in the country to be deported: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15679062 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15679062
  - jonhohle 8y ago
    First of all, an H-1B does not give someone not a lawful permanent residence. Second of all, it seems like his/her employer screwed up. The poster was vague on the timing, but if accurate, the employer was supposed to notify USCIS about the change prior to it taking affect (hence the response that they were not notified on time). “If you do not file an amended petition for these employees…, you will be out of compliance with USCIS regulation and policy and thus subject to adverse action. Similarly, your H-1B employees would not be maintaining their nonimmigrant status and would also be subject to adverse action. This is from a decision made in 2015. By changing locations prior to notification, they didn’t maintain their status. No ill will or targeting. USCIS did exactly what they said they would do.
    - deanmoriarty 8y ago
      LPR or not, it seems totally scary to me that a visa was revoked because the company committed a minor mistake in filing the notification: for all we know, the company filed the notification in a timely manner but sent a superfluous check with it that caused the document to be returned. In what world is this something that shouldn’t be considered a minor mistake and be looked past by an immigration officer, considering that the company was in good faith? Hell, the guy didn’t even change employer, it was a simple change of address for the same company!

EduardoBautista 8y ago

That has always been a possibility. Nothing new with this administration.

jexah 8y ago

> remove citizenship from naturalized citizens that they believe lied on their applications If the individual was given citizenship on the basis of those lies, then it makes total sense to revoke citizenship. That would be like hiring a developer who says he is an amazing programmer who can solve any problem. Turns out after he got the job, not only is he terrible at programming, but he's also a liar. So you fire him. If you lie on an application for something, and you are awarded, generally speaking it makes sense to revoke the award if it is discovered that you lied.

PaulAJ 8y ago
On the other hand, what if you say, for instance, that you got your degree in '93, but actually it was '92? The trouble with the law is that it doesn't distinguish between whoppers, fibs and clerical errors. They are all falsehoods, and all are grounds for deportation if the government decides it wants you out of the country.
- jexah 8y ago
  I assume you meant to say "you claimed you got your degree in 93 when you actually got it in 92". I work in the background check business and each check has its own windows of acceptance. Depending on how long ago the degree was awarded, the window can vary from 0 years to 10+ years. This is also contextual, as if the immigration application was submitted in 93, and you say you got your degree in 92, when you actually got it in 94, and your immigration was approved in 95. This is a clear case of an invalid application. Having said that, I'd like to see an example of deportation on the grounds of a 1 year mistake in the year one had received their degree, when the degree was received 30 years prior to application. I would like to see it not because I'd agree with such a measure, but because it would give you a strong case. As it stands I don't believe that anything close to that has happened.
ninedays 8y ago
If I continue the logic of your reasonning, the employer should have a technical test the candidate needs to perform in order for the employer to ensure that the candidate is not simply lying about his competences. If the employer gives the test, the employer hires him because he succeeded, then it is more the employer fault to hire him in the first place, not the employee fault because he performed the test. The moment a person becomes a citizen of a country, he is entitled to the exact same right that the citizen next to him. There is no distinction of a citizen who was born in the country vs a citizen that was naturalized. In your case, if someone profits from a lie, then we correct the process so that people cannot profit from it anymoreinstead of revoking things you gave by mistake (things _you_ gave by _your_ mistake). If you hire someone without checking that what they say is true, then I am sorry but you're just stupid. If a country give citizenship to people without verifying that what is written in the application is true, then I think the process is incredibly stupid.
- jexah 8y ago
  Okay let's just spend trillions of dollars giving every person who has applied for immigration complete background checks, and if any of the checks can't be completed for any reason what-so-ever, we should deny them citizenship. Sounds like a plan, Stan. That, or we just deny everybody because we can't afford it. Employers can afford to vet their employees. The state cannot afford to vet any regular citizenship application to the same degree. If we could, that'd be great. This is why it makes sense to assume the best in people (like we do), and if it turns out they intentionally lied or mislead on their application, then revoke the awards that were provided based on that misinformation.

bmelton 8y ago

Not to repeat myself, but this is similar to an action taken by the Obama administration. https://www.cnn.com/2016/09/19/politics/us-citizens-deported-report-fingerprints/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2016/09/19/politics/us-citizens-deported...

jonhohle 8y ago

I have sponsored an immigrant (have you?) who is now a citizen. If they were at even minimal risk of losing their citizenship, it would be horrifying. Since the articles referenced involve fraud on immigration applications, I’m sure there is zero percent risk of deportation in my case. Fraud requires intent. It’s not making a small mistake here and there on an application (been there, done that, fixed it, process goes on).

deanmoriarty 8y ago
Once again, this is a quote where a small "mistake" (if you can call it that) caused a visa holder already in the country to be deported: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15679062 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15679062
- jonhohle 8y ago
  First of all, an H-1B does not give someone not a lawful permanent residence. Second of all, it seems like his/her employer screwed up. The poster was vague on the timing, but if accurate, the employer was supposed to notify USCIS about the change prior to it taking affect (hence the response that they were not notified on time). “If you do not file an amended petition for these employees…, you will be out of compliance with USCIS regulation and policy and thus subject to adverse action. Similarly, your H-1B employees would not be maintaining their nonimmigrant status and would also be subject to adverse action. This is from a decision made in 2015. By changing locations prior to notification, they didn’t maintain their status. No ill will or targeting. USCIS did exactly what they said they would do.
  - deanmoriarty 8y ago
    LPR or not, it seems totally scary to me that a visa was revoked because the company committed a minor mistake in filing the notification: for all we know, the company filed the notification in a timely manner but sent a superfluous check with it that caused the document to be returned. In what world is this something that shouldn’t be considered a minor mistake and be looked past by an immigration officer, considering that the company was in good faith? Hell, the guy didn’t even change employer, it was a simple change of address for the same company!