5 ms·

The cost argument makes sense until you look at the numbers. Giving closed, private offices to each employee is expensive, but there are other options. You can

The cost argument makes sense until you look at the numbers. Giving closed, private offices to each employee is expensive, but there are other options. You can surround each employee with portable walls eight feet high for $2000 or less. If the lifetime of the wall is ten years, that's $200/employee a year. If you're working for a company that is so strapped for cash that it can't afford that, you should be looking for a new job, because your next paycheck isn't going to clear.

madeofpalk 8y ago
Somehow I don't think putting up eight feet walls around these "open plan" desks is not going to solve any problems.
- DoofusOfDeath 8y ago
  It might not solve all problems, but wouldn't you expect it to at least help dampen ambient noise from conversations, and visual distractions as well?
- bachmeier 8y ago
  They eliminate all visual distractions, provide privacy, block some noise, prevent others from talking to you directly, and force others to move discussions to a more appropriate place. And they have an advantage over a private office - others don't knock on your door to see if you're available.
- jpindar 8y ago
  >You can surround each employee Refers to cubicles which in my experience DID solve a lot of problems. People talk less when they don't see other people around them.
Bartweiss 8y ago
I wonder how much of a pay cut the average programmer would accept for different working conditions? I suspect cubicles effectively cost more than $200/year because they eat more space than open-plan desks, which forms the real cost. But even so, I suspect you could find a lot of people who would give up $1000/year of salary for that benefit. And even closed offices could probably be offset on a salary level. I think a lot of mid-career or later devs would probably give up an annual raise in return for a private office if they were offered an explicit choice. I could be wrong about specifics, maybe it's not cost effective to offer. But I seriously doubt that's how the choice is being made - I think a lot of people really do believe the hype about 'better collaboration', or just want to look like other companies.
- mikestew 8y ago
  I wonder how much of a pay cut the average programmer would accept for different working conditions? Somewhere else on this page is a comment from me that I'd take $20K/year less for an office with a door. I got my wish. There are other aspects to the job that make it appealing (short commute, laid back atmosphere, etc.), but if it were open office, I wouldn't have taken the job for the money it pays.
- Izkata 8y ago
  > they eat more space than open-plan desks, which forms the real cost Midway compromise, that we've joked about at work: Use those walls per-team instead of per-person.
jonhendry18 8y ago
One small place I worked made walls out of pairs of tall bookcases. The "cubicles" were along the perimeter of a large room, separated by the pairs of bookcases. Each cubicle was bounded by sets of bookcases and one wall, with one side open to the center of the room. A little more spending would have obtained traditional cubicle walls to close off the open side, but it worked pretty well in practice. On the other side of the room were a whiteboard and a conference table, and lunch was typically eaten at that conference table. That said there were only like 5 desks in that room, and I'm not sure how well it would scale.

madeofpalk 8y ago

Somehow I don't think putting up eight feet walls around these "open plan" desks is not going to solve any problems.

DoofusOfDeath 8y ago
It might not solve all problems, but wouldn't you expect it to at least help dampen ambient noise from conversations, and visual distractions as well?
bachmeier 8y ago
They eliminate all visual distractions, provide privacy, block some noise, prevent others from talking to you directly, and force others to move discussions to a more appropriate place. And they have an advantage over a private office - others don't knock on your door to see if you're available.
jpindar 8y ago
>You can surround each employee Refers to cubicles which in my experience DID solve a lot of problems. People talk less when they don't see other people around them.

Bartweiss 8y ago

I wonder how much of a pay cut the average programmer would accept for different working conditions? I suspect cubicles effectively cost more than $200/year because they eat more space than open-plan desks, which forms the real cost. But even so, I suspect you could find a lot of people who would give up $1000/year of salary for that benefit. And even closed offices could probably be offset on a salary level. I think a lot of mid-career or later devs would probably give up an annual raise in return for a private office if they were offered an explicit choice. I could be wrong about specifics, maybe it's not cost effective to offer. But I seriously doubt that's how the choice is being made - I think a lot of people really do believe the hype about 'better collaboration', or just want to look like other companies.

mikestew 8y ago
I wonder how much of a pay cut the average programmer would accept for different working conditions? Somewhere else on this page is a comment from me that I'd take $20K/year less for an office with a door. I got my wish. There are other aspects to the job that make it appealing (short commute, laid back atmosphere, etc.), but if it were open office, I wouldn't have taken the job for the money it pays.
Izkata 8y ago
> they eat more space than open-plan desks, which forms the real cost Midway compromise, that we've joked about at work: Use those walls per-team instead of per-person.

jonhendry18 8y ago

One small place I worked made walls out of pairs of tall bookcases. The "cubicles" were along the perimeter of a large room, separated by the pairs of bookcases. Each cubicle was bounded by sets of bookcases and one wall, with one side open to the center of the room. A little more spending would have obtained traditional cubicle walls to close off the open side, but it worked pretty well in practice. On the other side of the room were a whiteboard and a conference table, and lunch was typically eaten at that conference table. That said there were only like 5 desks in that room, and I'm not sure how well it would scale.