4 ms·

I assume it was his decision to take all those children down there, so it was not beyond his control. Did he at least check the weather forecast? If my comment

I assume it was his decision to take all those children down there, so it was not beyond his control. Did he at least check the weather forecast? If my comment was designed to provoke, then it was to provoke people to think. We need to be able to think for ourselves sometimes. I actually find your comment somewhat unhelpful and grating. It is all very well everyone being a hero and never admitting to any wrong decisions but that is exactly the sort of attitude that leads to these situations and to their repetition. If nobody has done anything wrong, there is nothing to learn.

fabricexpert 8y ago
Your idea of learning from this is to say "What was he thinking?", which in your context is is a rhetorical question. You're not trying to understand the thought process, instead you're making a statement to imply that the leader wasn't thinking about the group's safety when taking them into the cave and is negligent. This may or may not be true, or could be somewhere in between. But it specifically does not, and actually actively pushes against finding a solution that ensures this never happens again. By blaming someone for an error instead of the system that allowed, encouraged and enabled them to make that error you end up not solving anything, and the same problems crop up again, and again.
- ahelwer 8y ago
  Blaming the system works in urban environments or corporate engineering processes. Vast swathes of the world have no "system" to protect you, except for maybe a sign if sufficiently many people have died from a hazard and somebody cared enough to make one (and overcame pushback about disturbing the environment). Examples of such environments include backcountry travel, rural living (even in developed countries), and most certainly caving.

4 ms·

I assume it was his decision to take all those children down there, so it was not beyond his control. Did he at least check the weather forecast? If my comment

by SagelyGuru 8y ago

fabricexpert 8y ago
Your idea of learning from this is to say "What was he thinking?", which in your context is is a rhetorical question. You're not trying to understand the thought process, instead you're making a statement to imply that the leader wasn't thinking about the group's safety when taking them into the cave and is negligent. This may or may not be true, or could be somewhere in between. But it specifically does not, and actually actively pushes against finding a solution that ensures this never happens again. By blaming someone for an error instead of the system that allowed, encouraged and enabled them to make that error you end up not solving anything, and the same problems crop up again, and again.
- ahelwer 8y ago
  Blaming the system works in urban environments or corporate engineering processes. Vast swathes of the world have no "system" to protect you, except for maybe a sign if sufficiently many people have died from a hazard and somebody cared enough to make one (and overcame pushback about disturbing the environment). Examples of such environments include backcountry travel, rural living (even in developed countries), and most certainly caving.