3 ms·

Does this also mean compressing/decompressing water can generate an electric field?

by fooker 8y ago

stephengillie 8y ago
Probably, but it would take a lot of mechanical force. From the article: > The compression is only 3 percent, but that pressurizes the water—it's equivalent to 100 atmospheres Although, that's not uncommon for ice giants, so it might be causing part of Ouranos (aka Uranus) magnetic field. > The troposphere is thought to have a highly complex cloud structure; water clouds are hypothesised to lie in the pressure range of 50 to 100 bar[1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uranus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uranus
- rdlecler1 8y ago
  Implication: Depending on the energy input, couldn’t you create an engine from this? Sounds like a perpetual motion machine.
  - stephengillie 8y ago
    This effect does convert energy from mechanical to electrical, and so could be used in a type of engine. But AFAIK there would still be inefficiencies causing this conversion to be less than 100%, and so sadly not a perpetual motion machine.
- CamperBob2 8y ago
  Coincidentally, I just watched a great video by Ben Krasnow yesterday that suggests that the answer to fooker's question is indeed "Yes." There are other well-known principles along these lines, ranging from piezoelectricity to the Seebeck and Peltier effects, and it's almost more of a rule than an exception for such effects to behave symmetrically. Glowing plasma created by a high speed jet of water: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vTq8oGpqwM&list=LLaIdy5TkkQclZa0K4LaCJEw&index=2&t=0s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vTq8oGpqwM&list=LLaIdy5TkkQ... He definitely has the "whole lot of mechanical force" thing going for him, considering that he's about 2 psi away from fragging himself with a hydraulic cylinder.
Beldin 8y ago
Nah, probably not.from how i read it, is not that the field is strong, but that it's so incredibly localised. The molecules arrange along the field lines (H being more positive and O more negative). Since the field lines are so close in this case, and the field's gradient (more or less: inverse of width between field lines) is so high, the O parts snuggle together a bit more, as do the H parts. Anyway, that's how i read the article. (Please correct me if I'm wrong) Compressing water, however, does not force the molecules to align (as far as I know). So no field generation by compression - at least not from my understanding of this experiment.
- klodolph 8y ago
  Well, maybe compressing water does not force molecules to align this way, bu enough pressure will cause water to align in a crystal lattice (not normal ice but something exotic like ice III, ice V, or ice VI).

Does this also mean compressing/decompressing water can generate an electric field?

by fooker 8y ago

Does this also mean compressing/decompressing water can generate an electric field?

Probably, but it would take a lot of mechanical force. From the article: > The compression is only 3 percent, but that pressurizes the water—it's equivalent to 100 atmospheres Although, that's not uncommon for ice giants, so it might be causing part of Ouranos (aka Uranus) magnetic field. > The troposphere is thought to have a highly complex cloud structure; water clouds are hypothesised to lie in the pressure range of 50 to 100 bar[1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uranus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uranus

rdlecler1 8y ago
Implication: Depending on the energy input, couldn’t you create an engine from this? Sounds like a perpetual motion machine.
- stephengillie 8y ago
  This effect does convert energy from mechanical to electrical, and so could be used in a type of engine. But AFAIK there would still be inefficiencies causing this conversion to be less than 100%, and so sadly not a perpetual motion machine.
CamperBob2 8y ago
Coincidentally, I just watched a great video by Ben Krasnow yesterday that suggests that the answer to fooker's question is indeed "Yes." There are other well-known principles along these lines, ranging from piezoelectricity to the Seebeck and Peltier effects, and it's almost more of a rule than an exception for such effects to behave symmetrically. Glowing plasma created by a high speed jet of water: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vTq8oGpqwM&list=LLaIdy5TkkQclZa0K4LaCJEw&index=2&t=0s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vTq8oGpqwM&list=LLaIdy5TkkQ... He definitely has the "whole lot of mechanical force" thing going for him, considering that he's about 2 psi away from fragging himself with a hydraulic cylinder.

Beldin 8y ago

Nah, probably not.from how i read it, is not that the field is strong, but that it's so incredibly localised. The molecules arrange along the field lines (H being more positive and O more negative). Since the field lines are so close in this case, and the field's gradient (more or less: inverse of width between field lines) is so high, the O parts snuggle together a bit more, as do the H parts. Anyway, that's how i read the article. (Please correct me if I'm wrong) Compressing water, however, does not force the molecules to align (as far as I know). So no field generation by compression - at least not from my understanding of this experiment.

klodolph 8y ago
Well, maybe compressing water does not force molecules to align this way, bu enough pressure will cause water to align in a crystal lattice (not normal ice but something exotic like ice III, ice V, or ice VI).