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The German train system uses TTS in all stations to announce (among other things) delays and cancellations. Cancellations are usually followed by the phrase "we

The German train system uses TTS in all stations to announce (among other things) delays and cancellations. Cancellations are usually followed by the phrase "we apologize". This has always been for me the most infuriating part: that the fakest of apologies was attached to it. In contrast, getting actual information about the delay works for me, precisely because it feels more honest.

kaybe 8y ago
I feel like they increasingly inform about causes of delays too though. It has been worse in the past.
withdavidli 8y ago
Using the DB app is really helpful to me. All delays are near real-time. It makes using public transport so much easier. Now the German ticketing machine, please fix that so it includes the stops instead of just end points.
pluma 8y ago
The most infuriating part for me with the local transport agency in Cologne (KVB) is the verbosity. They use a 90s style unbearably slow ticker display. So if you catch a glimpse at the wrong moment you're stuck reading all the unimportant garbage while trying to figure out whether the message is even relevant to you. This is especially bad with cancellations because it lists every major stop (with station name and time) for the canceled tram. So instead of getting the important information instantly you are stuck waiting for the message to end and then repeat to the point that's actually important. I realise this is a technical limitation because apparently all affected stations get the same message but this seems fairly archaic while at the same time also being an obvious cost-cutting move over having actual announcements. In general however the infuriating part about the apologies is that instead of "we apologize for the inconvenience" a more literal translation of the one you see most often -- "Danke für Ihr Verständnis" -- is "thank you for your understanding", which comes off as super passive-aggressive compared to the more apologetic but much less frequent "Wir bitten um Verständnis" ("we ask for your understanding"). Sure, they're both hollow phrases but thanking you seems extremely condescending.
- cpeterso 8y ago
  > They use a 90s style unbearably slow ticker display. So if you catch a glimpse at the wrong moment you're stuck reading all the unimportant garbage while trying to figure out whether the message is even relevant to you. BART in the SF Bay Area is the same. The tickers slooowly scroll through repeated public service announcements and ads before eventually showing the train ETAs and current time for five seconds. They should show that important information all the time.
  - jon_richards 8y ago
    The American subways I've been to seem to all suffer from the realization that you can put advertising anywhere you could put a map.
    - workinfunk 8y ago
      I, and many others I'm sure, would appreciate it if you would actually put some effort into your half-hearted America slams. All the subways I've been in, EU and US, have plenty of both ads and maps.
- Symbiote 8y ago
  How about the English one, copied from [1] with an example train included: "May I have your attention please on platform 1. We are sorry to announce that the nineteen-fourteen South West Trains service to Windsor and Eton Riverside has been cancelled. This is due to a failed train at Richmond. South West Trains apologises for the inconvenience caused." At least some parts of that one are useful. I found hearing things like "This is a safety announcement. Due to today's inclement weather, please take extra care whilst on the station. Surfaces may be slippery." and "Security personnel tour this station 24 hours a day." very annoying. (And I said "English" intentionally. You can at least double the length of these, Welsh first, in Wales.) [1] http://automatedannouncements.wikia.com/wiki/Generic_Station_Announcements http://automatedannouncements.wikia.com/wiki/Generic_Station...
- JackCh 8y ago
  The best display technology IMHO is the old electro-mechanical split-flap. They update pretty fast, and they make one hell of a racket when they do so everybody in the train station knows when something updated (this is a feature). They're sufficiently versatile to display information a train station needs to. They also have a certain aesthetic that simply cannot be touched by modern LCD/LED displays.
dgellow 8y ago
Isn’t this “fake” politeness part of the German culture? I see it in everything related to business communication, from banks, insurances, public services, etc. Even from retail stores. That has been explained to me as being part of the etiquette for proper communication, which seems to be quite important in Germany, even if everybody I asked agreed that it was empty and meaningless.
- freeflight 8y ago
  It indeed is, in a way German culture is very similar to something like Japanese culture, where the social form is way more important than actual intent/content. For the same reason, the German language has very complex honorifics [0]. Some Germans take real offense if you don't address them with the proper honorific or forget to list one of their, oh so important, honorific titles on some text communication. Because of this, there exists quite a lively market to sell honorific titles, specifically aimed at German-speaking users [1], in that regard there still exists a very real "class distinction" in Germany. Stuff like that always makes me wonder how much influence population density has on the evolution of such strict social dynamics. [0] https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/H%C3%B6flichkeitsform#Die_H%C3%B6flichkeitsform_in_der_deutschen_Sprache https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/H%C3%B6flichkeitsform#Die_H%C3... [1] https://title-town.eu/ https://title-town.eu/
- Maultasche 8y ago
  When living in Germany, I found that the Germans were quite blunt in comparison to the United States and discarded a lot of the word fluff and fake friendliness that I often see people using in the United States. They prefer to be direct and get to the point. There was no need to beat around the bush and hint politely at something. So the attitude of getting rid of the meaningless words and stick directly to the information seems like a very German attitude to me. However, I also found (particularly in written contexts) that the Germans were really big on formality. If you don't use their proper titles, they'll get very upset. If the paperwork doesn't have an official stamp on it, it's meaningless waste paper. If it does have an official stamp on it, then it's holy and undisputed, no matter what nonsense is written on it. I'm surprised that there isn't a flourishing fake official stamp black market because of the importance people place on those things. I find that all the fluff in German written documents revolves around formality, rather than fake politeness. I always got the feeling that all those extra, meaningless words and phrases were more about doing it the proper, formal way (no matter how meaningless that was), whereas in the United States, the people are much more informal, but use a lot of fluff words to convey fake friendliness. German academic writing is ridiculous. There's so much formality and academic vocabulary involved that they'll write long, complex sentences with fancy vocabulary to convey a simple concept. It's about as formal as you can possibly imagine, so it's wordiness and complexity has to compensate.

kaybe 8y ago

I feel like they increasingly inform about causes of delays too though. It has been worse in the past.

withdavidli 8y ago

Using the DB app is really helpful to me. All delays are near real-time. It makes using public transport so much easier. Now the German ticketing machine, please fix that so it includes the stops instead of just end points.

pluma 8y ago

The most infuriating part for me with the local transport agency in Cologne (KVB) is the verbosity. They use a 90s style unbearably slow ticker display. So if you catch a glimpse at the wrong moment you're stuck reading all the unimportant garbage while trying to figure out whether the message is even relevant to you. This is especially bad with cancellations because it lists every major stop (with station name and time) for the canceled tram. So instead of getting the important information instantly you are stuck waiting for the message to end and then repeat to the point that's actually important. I realise this is a technical limitation because apparently all affected stations get the same message but this seems fairly archaic while at the same time also being an obvious cost-cutting move over having actual announcements. In general however the infuriating part about the apologies is that instead of "we apologize for the inconvenience" a more literal translation of the one you see most often -- "Danke für Ihr Verständnis" -- is "thank you for your understanding", which comes off as super passive-aggressive compared to the more apologetic but much less frequent "Wir bitten um Verständnis" ("we ask for your understanding"). Sure, they're both hollow phrases but thanking you seems extremely condescending.

cpeterso 8y ago
> They use a 90s style unbearably slow ticker display. So if you catch a glimpse at the wrong moment you're stuck reading all the unimportant garbage while trying to figure out whether the message is even relevant to you. BART in the SF Bay Area is the same. The tickers slooowly scroll through repeated public service announcements and ads before eventually showing the train ETAs and current time for five seconds. They should show that important information all the time.
- jon_richards 8y ago
  The American subways I've been to seem to all suffer from the realization that you can put advertising anywhere you could put a map.
  - workinfunk 8y ago
    I, and many others I'm sure, would appreciate it if you would actually put some effort into your half-hearted America slams. All the subways I've been in, EU and US, have plenty of both ads and maps.
Symbiote 8y ago
How about the English one, copied from [1] with an example train included: "May I have your attention please on platform 1. We are sorry to announce that the nineteen-fourteen South West Trains service to Windsor and Eton Riverside has been cancelled. This is due to a failed train at Richmond. South West Trains apologises for the inconvenience caused." At least some parts of that one are useful. I found hearing things like "This is a safety announcement. Due to today's inclement weather, please take extra care whilst on the station. Surfaces may be slippery." and "Security personnel tour this station 24 hours a day." very annoying. (And I said "English" intentionally. You can at least double the length of these, Welsh first, in Wales.) [1] http://automatedannouncements.wikia.com/wiki/Generic_Station_Announcements http://automatedannouncements.wikia.com/wiki/Generic_Station...
JackCh 8y ago
The best display technology IMHO is the old electro-mechanical split-flap. They update pretty fast, and they make one hell of a racket when they do so everybody in the train station knows when something updated (this is a feature). They're sufficiently versatile to display information a train station needs to. They also have a certain aesthetic that simply cannot be touched by modern LCD/LED displays.

dgellow 8y ago

Isn’t this “fake” politeness part of the German culture? I see it in everything related to business communication, from banks, insurances, public services, etc. Even from retail stores. That has been explained to me as being part of the etiquette for proper communication, which seems to be quite important in Germany, even if everybody I asked agreed that it was empty and meaningless.

freeflight 8y ago
It indeed is, in a way German culture is very similar to something like Japanese culture, where the social form is way more important than actual intent/content. For the same reason, the German language has very complex honorifics [0]. Some Germans take real offense if you don't address them with the proper honorific or forget to list one of their, oh so important, honorific titles on some text communication. Because of this, there exists quite a lively market to sell honorific titles, specifically aimed at German-speaking users [1], in that regard there still exists a very real "class distinction" in Germany. Stuff like that always makes me wonder how much influence population density has on the evolution of such strict social dynamics. [0] https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/H%C3%B6flichkeitsform#Die_H%C3%B6flichkeitsform_in_der_deutschen_Sprache https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/H%C3%B6flichkeitsform#Die_H%C3... [1] https://title-town.eu/ https://title-town.eu/
Maultasche 8y ago
When living in Germany, I found that the Germans were quite blunt in comparison to the United States and discarded a lot of the word fluff and fake friendliness that I often see people using in the United States. They prefer to be direct and get to the point. There was no need to beat around the bush and hint politely at something. So the attitude of getting rid of the meaningless words and stick directly to the information seems like a very German attitude to me. However, I also found (particularly in written contexts) that the Germans were really big on formality. If you don't use their proper titles, they'll get very upset. If the paperwork doesn't have an official stamp on it, it's meaningless waste paper. If it does have an official stamp on it, then it's holy and undisputed, no matter what nonsense is written on it. I'm surprised that there isn't a flourishing fake official stamp black market because of the importance people place on those things. I find that all the fluff in German written documents revolves around formality, rather than fake politeness. I always got the feeling that all those extra, meaningless words and phrases were more about doing it the proper, formal way (no matter how meaningless that was), whereas in the United States, the people are much more informal, but use a lot of fluff words to convey fake friendliness. German academic writing is ridiculous. There's so much formality and academic vocabulary involved that they'll write long, complex sentences with fancy vocabulary to convey a simple concept. It's about as formal as you can possibly imagine, so it's wordiness and complexity has to compensate.