5 ms·

>If I give a company my data, In some cases you're not knowingly giving them your data either.

axaxs 8y ago
That's the depressing part. I usually shop at Meijer because they were the last grocery left without annoying loyalty cards. As of this year, I've began receiving in the mail coupons for specific items I'd bought there. So either my credit card company has sold my data, or it was 'stolen' when they scanned my license to buy beer at some point(they require scanning the license, not DOB entry). I'm tired of this.
- patrickg_zill 8y ago
  The credit card info is called "level 3 data" and they in some cases have line item by line item detail. Not just "spend $24.89 at Meijer store #349" but each individual thing, e.g. you bought 2 avocados.
  - axaxs 8y ago
    Is that recent? I just started getting it this year. Is there a way to opt out?
    - patrickg_zill 8y ago
      From what I know, it started a few years ago; but not all big stores had the equipment in place to send it (the cc processors give them a discount for sending the line-item level 3 data). With the advent of the chip and pin cards in the USA, it seems logical that just about everyone upgraded to equipment that does support it; which might explain why you are only seeing this in the past year.
      - axaxs 8y ago
        So, this seems a little opposite of what I meant. Naive me always assumed I pay with a card, the store gets my cc info to charge and we part ways. I'm getting in the mail ads from Meijer, for items I buy frequently. This tells me they were able to extract my home address and name from my credit card. Is that accurate?
        thelastidiot 8y ago
        Yes, these data are all available, if you are willing to pay to get those.
        18pfsmt 8y ago
        I worked for the largest merchant acquirer ~11 years ago, and we were collecting SKU-level data for Wal-mart at that time.
    - lotsofpulp 8y ago
      I noticed that now when my employees buy from staples.com, my AmEx statement will show everything they bought. From a manager's perspective, it's kind of awesome because you don't need to keep track of little receipts.
  - dizzant 8y ago
    Is this data available to mortals? I don't even have digital itemized receipts for credit card purchases, and it's my purchase!
    - propogandist 8y ago
      Mastercard and Visa [1] sell this data in aggregate to firms via brokers like Bluekai, to allow for ad-targeting. I don't believe it'll be feasible to purchase just one person's purchase data [easily], but if you knew who you wanted to get to, it should be possible to narrow the targeting to get to them [1] http://www.oracle.com/us/solutions/cloud/data-directory-2810741.pdf http://www.oracle.com/us/solutions/cloud/data-directory-2810... [ctrl+F + mastercard]
      - discordance 8y ago
        Wouldn't a GDPR request to Visa or MasterCard in the EU get me this data?
        black_puppydog 8y ago
        That's what I was thinking. Would be awesome for personal budgeting...
        namibj 8y ago
        Well, they have to provide it digital, if they already have it digital. So yeah. Anyone wanna integrate the format they can deliver with e.g. GNUCash or so?
  - greglindahl 8y ago
    How does this work with Apple Pay, which doesn't tell the retailer who the consumer is? Does the retailer sell the info, or the credit card company?
    - macintux 8y ago
      Wondered about that too. Apparently Apple Pay does use the same artificial CC number with each payment (maybe only with the same merchant?) so it's still possible to have your purchases tracked over time, even if they don't know who you are.
  - jimjimjim 8y ago
    usually there is only space for group ids of items rather than individual item details. but i guess it might be different for different acquirers. the purpose of loyalty cards is that the messages are usually acquired or processed on non-bank systems so they can go into much greater detail and include individual sale item details
  - bb101 8y ago
    I wonder if the credit card companies have access to line-item level 3 data if we use ApplePay?
- mulmen 8y ago
  I have no problem with loyalty cards. It helps the store work more efficiently and sell me more relevant products. I have a problem when the loyalty card is tied to my identity and any data from anywhere else.
- fencepost 8y ago
  I usually shop at Meijer because they were the last grocery left without annoying loyalty cards. (quizzical look) Are you aware of their MPerks program? Tied to your phone number and an email address, electronic receipts, tracking of your savings, online/in-app clipping of coupons auto-applied at checkout time, automatic "rewards" of $2-3 for every $150 you spend. The only part of a traditional loyalty card program it doesn't have is making their sale prices apply only with card, but it definitely gives you measurable (and measured) discounts both passively through those "rewards" and actively via the in-app coupons.
  - axaxs 8y ago
    Yeah I'm aware. I am not signed up for them. That's the reason I don't like Kroger, their stuff is way marked up without a card. That said, I figured out a 'trick' of just asking for a card and saying you'll fill out the application at home. Doesn't seem like such a trick now since they're all just tracking me by my payment methods. Oh well.
socialist_coder 8y ago
I just signed a rental agreement for an apartment in the US and in the fine print it says that they can share your data with whoever they want. You can't even opt out. Pretty fucked up.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- JumpCrisscross 8y ago
  > You can't even opt out I scratched that, and other lines, out of my rental agreement when I rented my New York apartment. The landlord agreed.
  - SkyMarshal 8y ago
    I wonder, do they then just enter your data into their database and sell it all anyway? Is there some way for you to ensure it's not included in all the other tenant data they share?
- Angostura 8y ago
  I bought a car earlier this year. Exciting purchase. We had got to the final bit before they hand over the keys and there was some paperwork to sign. On page 3 was the small print about us agreeing to give our data to everyone. So I refused and made it clear I would walk away. The sales guy went though the whole ‘it’s not a problem, I’ve bought cars from here and haven’t got spammed’. In the end he had to get a manager and it turned out that the option could be removed from the contract, three menus down in the system. Sounds like no one had ever asked before. I imagine GDPR will have changed this to opt-in.

That's the depressing part. I usually shop at Meijer because they were the last grocery left without annoying loyalty cards. As of this year, I've began receiving in the mail coupons for specific items I'd bought there. So either my credit card company has sold my data, or it was 'stolen' when they scanned my license to buy beer at some point(they require scanning the license, not DOB entry). I'm tired of this.

patrickg_zill 8y ago
The credit card info is called "level 3 data" and they in some cases have line item by line item detail. Not just "spend $24.89 at Meijer store #349" but each individual thing, e.g. you bought 2 avocados.
- axaxs 8y ago
  Is that recent? I just started getting it this year. Is there a way to opt out?
  - patrickg_zill 8y ago
    From what I know, it started a few years ago; but not all big stores had the equipment in place to send it (the cc processors give them a discount for sending the line-item level 3 data). With the advent of the chip and pin cards in the USA, it seems logical that just about everyone upgraded to equipment that does support it; which might explain why you are only seeing this in the past year.
    - axaxs 8y ago
      So, this seems a little opposite of what I meant. Naive me always assumed I pay with a card, the store gets my cc info to charge and we part ways. I'm getting in the mail ads from Meijer, for items I buy frequently. This tells me they were able to extract my home address and name from my credit card. Is that accurate?
      - thelastidiot 8y ago
        Yes, these data are all available, if you are willing to pay to get those.
      - 18pfsmt 8y ago
        I worked for the largest merchant acquirer ~11 years ago, and we were collecting SKU-level data for Wal-mart at that time.
  - lotsofpulp 8y ago
    I noticed that now when my employees buy from staples.com, my AmEx statement will show everything they bought. From a manager's perspective, it's kind of awesome because you don't need to keep track of little receipts.
- dizzant 8y ago
  Is this data available to mortals? I don't even have digital itemized receipts for credit card purchases, and it's my purchase!
  - propogandist 8y ago
    Mastercard and Visa [1] sell this data in aggregate to firms via brokers like Bluekai, to allow for ad-targeting. I don't believe it'll be feasible to purchase just one person's purchase data [easily], but if you knew who you wanted to get to, it should be possible to narrow the targeting to get to them [1] http://www.oracle.com/us/solutions/cloud/data-directory-2810741.pdf http://www.oracle.com/us/solutions/cloud/data-directory-2810... [ctrl+F + mastercard]
    - discordance 8y ago
      Wouldn't a GDPR request to Visa or MasterCard in the EU get me this data?
      - black_puppydog 8y ago
        That's what I was thinking. Would be awesome for personal budgeting...
        namibj 8y ago
        Well, they have to provide it digital, if they already have it digital. So yeah. Anyone wanna integrate the format they can deliver with e.g. GNUCash or so?
- greglindahl 8y ago
  How does this work with Apple Pay, which doesn't tell the retailer who the consumer is? Does the retailer sell the info, or the credit card company?
  - macintux 8y ago
    Wondered about that too. Apparently Apple Pay does use the same artificial CC number with each payment (maybe only with the same merchant?) so it's still possible to have your purchases tracked over time, even if they don't know who you are.
- jimjimjim 8y ago
  usually there is only space for group ids of items rather than individual item details. but i guess it might be different for different acquirers. the purpose of loyalty cards is that the messages are usually acquired or processed on non-bank systems so they can go into much greater detail and include individual sale item details
- bb101 8y ago
  I wonder if the credit card companies have access to line-item level 3 data if we use ApplePay?
mulmen 8y ago
I have no problem with loyalty cards. It helps the store work more efficiently and sell me more relevant products. I have a problem when the loyalty card is tied to my identity and any data from anywhere else.
fencepost 8y ago
I usually shop at Meijer because they were the last grocery left without annoying loyalty cards. (quizzical look) Are you aware of their MPerks program? Tied to your phone number and an email address, electronic receipts, tracking of your savings, online/in-app clipping of coupons auto-applied at checkout time, automatic "rewards" of $2-3 for every $150 you spend. The only part of a traditional loyalty card program it doesn't have is making their sale prices apply only with card, but it definitely gives you measurable (and measured) discounts both passively through those "rewards" and actively via the in-app coupons.
- axaxs 8y ago
  Yeah I'm aware. I am not signed up for them. That's the reason I don't like Kroger, their stuff is way marked up without a card. That said, I figured out a 'trick' of just asking for a card and saying you'll fill out the application at home. Doesn't seem like such a trick now since they're all just tracking me by my payment methods. Oh well.

socialist_coder 8y ago

I just signed a rental agreement for an apartment in the US and in the fine print it says that they can share your data with whoever they want. You can't even opt out. Pretty fucked up.

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
JumpCrisscross 8y ago
> You can't even opt out I scratched that, and other lines, out of my rental agreement when I rented my New York apartment. The landlord agreed.
- SkyMarshal 8y ago
  I wonder, do they then just enter your data into their database and sell it all anyway? Is there some way for you to ensure it's not included in all the other tenant data they share?
Angostura 8y ago
I bought a car earlier this year. Exciting purchase. We had got to the final bit before they hand over the keys and there was some paperwork to sign. On page 3 was the small print about us agreeing to give our data to everyone. So I refused and made it clear I would walk away. The sales guy went though the whole ‘it’s not a problem, I’ve bought cars from here and haven’t got spammed’. In the end he had to get a manager and it turned out that the option could be removed from the contract, three menus down in the system. Sounds like no one had ever asked before. I imagine GDPR will have changed this to opt-in.