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Which is different from other civil law in what ways? Anyone can sue you over any civil law. Then teh courts decides. GDPR is not magically different. This is a

Which is different from other civil law in what ways? Anyone can sue you over any civil law. Then teh courts decides. GDPR is not magically different. This is a straw man. The flurry of activities is only driven by companies who keep data about their users. Of course "legitimate" will be defined by the courts. That's the price you have to pay now for all the abuses that have been going on for the past two or three decades. History has shown that to define "legitimate" the text of the law is to open the doors to avoidance. Sorry mate, we can't trust you to be honest. It's too late now.

JumpCrisscross 8y ago
> Anyone can sue you over any civil law The burden for filing a lawsuit is significantly higher than the burden for making a regulatory complaint.
- s73v3r_ 8y ago
  But in Europe, someone is more likely to complain to regulators than to sue you themselves.
- xyzzyz 8y ago
  That's true. That's why in my most recent dispute with insurance in Washington state, I filed a complaint to Washington State Insurance Commission. The Commission sent then a formal request to the insurance company in question, which suddenly made the insurance company much more eager to pay me what I think they owed me. Of course, just as you mentioned above, responding to complaints is distracting and expensive, which is why all insurance companies folded up the business up here, and there's no more insurance to be bought in Washington. (I'm kidding of course, insurance companies work here just fine.)
  - JumpCrisscross 8y ago
    > The Commission sent then a formal request to the insurance company in question, which suddenly made the insurance company much more eager to pay me what I think they owed me I'm a huge fan of complain-and-respond frameworks. I have complained to my state Attorney General when my cable company change pricing on me mid-contract. I complained to my state Department of Financial Services when a rebate issuer sent me a card instead of a cheque. I complained, the other night, when a construction company decided to run jackhammers on 26th Street at 1:30 in the morning. Complain-and-respond regimes work. They're also expensive, and cause known incumbency biases. Deploying them should be carefully considered. For insurance and financial services, the tradeoff makes sense. For literally every business that might ever touch a European's data, it's a bit overblown.
    - xyzzyz 8y ago
      Deploying them should be carefully considered. For insurance and financial services, the tradeoff makes sense. For literally every business that might ever touch a European's data, it's a bit overblown. That's a fair argument to make. The counterpoint is that before GDPR we had so many problems with companies mishandling data that "a bit overblown" is not something that everyone would agree with. Additionally, some countries (e.g. above-mentioned Poland) had GDPR-like laws (Ustawa z dnia 29 sierpnia 1997 r. o ochronie danych osobowych) for over two decades now, with a corresponding regulatory office (Generalny Inspektor Ochrony Danych Osobowych) that regularly looked into complaints. In practice it turned out to work great, local businesses easily complied with the law, and nobody saw this as a huge hassle in the two decades of the application of the law. I find it hard to believe that it's going to get much worse than that with GDPR. Many companies are just overreacting here really.
      - JumpCrisscross 8y ago
        > before GDPR we had so many problems with companies mishandling data that "a bit overblown" is not something that everyone would agree with GDPR should have had a minimum revenue threshold for the bulk of its requirements. Enforcement should have also been centralized in a single EU enforcer. A simple process for obtaining non-compulsory affirmative compliance certificates, for businesses at or below the revenue threshold, would have also been nice. > I find it hard to believe that it's going to get much worse than that with GDPR I see Facebook and Google gaining market share and failing to change their behavior. In addition, Europe is no longer a market one launches in simultaneously with the U.S. and Asia for most foreign businesses. This whole episode is deeply frustrating as I'm strongly anti-Facebook and pro-privacy rights. The degree to which the EU turned an opportunity to lead into a wholesale boondoggle is jaw-dropping.
        bmer 8y ago
        > In addition, Europe is no longer a market one launches in simultaneously with the U.S. and Asia for most foreign businesses. Since that's a broad statement, would you care to back it up? > I see Facebook and Google gaining market share and failing to change their behavior. In addition, Europe is no longer a market one launches in simultaneously with the U.S. and Asia for most foreign businesses. Are you saying that Facebook and Google are not GDPR compliant, and that furthermore, the EU doesn't care that they are not GDPR compliant?
onetimemanytime 8y ago
>>Anyone can sue you over any civil law. Then teh courts decides. GDPR is not magically different. This is a straw man. Yeah, but in this case that "anyone" is not spending a dime of his own, instead the limitless resources of EU will be coming after you. By the time the court decides, virtually any small company will bankrupt.
- oblio 8y ago
  The EU has a budget about the size of the Romanian one, a country with a GDP of €200bn. Their budget is minuscule by country standards.
- bmer 8y ago
  Why the assumption that the EU won't side with you, and will definitely only side with the person making the claim? Certainly, if you're compliant, there's a very good chance that you'll get off the complaint, yeah?
- elygre 8y ago
  The limitless resources of the government is never applied to all laws. Regulatory institutions are budget constrained like the rest of us, and will prioritize what it considers to be the worst cases.

JumpCrisscross 8y ago

> Anyone can sue you over any civil law The burden for filing a lawsuit is significantly higher than the burden for making a regulatory complaint.

s73v3r_ 8y ago
But in Europe, someone is more likely to complain to regulators than to sue you themselves.
xyzzyz 8y ago
That's true. That's why in my most recent dispute with insurance in Washington state, I filed a complaint to Washington State Insurance Commission. The Commission sent then a formal request to the insurance company in question, which suddenly made the insurance company much more eager to pay me what I think they owed me. Of course, just as you mentioned above, responding to complaints is distracting and expensive, which is why all insurance companies folded up the business up here, and there's no more insurance to be bought in Washington. (I'm kidding of course, insurance companies work here just fine.)
- JumpCrisscross 8y ago
  > The Commission sent then a formal request to the insurance company in question, which suddenly made the insurance company much more eager to pay me what I think they owed me I'm a huge fan of complain-and-respond frameworks. I have complained to my state Attorney General when my cable company change pricing on me mid-contract. I complained to my state Department of Financial Services when a rebate issuer sent me a card instead of a cheque. I complained, the other night, when a construction company decided to run jackhammers on 26th Street at 1:30 in the morning. Complain-and-respond regimes work. They're also expensive, and cause known incumbency biases. Deploying them should be carefully considered. For insurance and financial services, the tradeoff makes sense. For literally every business that might ever touch a European's data, it's a bit overblown.
  - xyzzyz 8y ago
    Deploying them should be carefully considered. For insurance and financial services, the tradeoff makes sense. For literally every business that might ever touch a European's data, it's a bit overblown. That's a fair argument to make. The counterpoint is that before GDPR we had so many problems with companies mishandling data that "a bit overblown" is not something that everyone would agree with. Additionally, some countries (e.g. above-mentioned Poland) had GDPR-like laws (Ustawa z dnia 29 sierpnia 1997 r. o ochronie danych osobowych) for over two decades now, with a corresponding regulatory office (Generalny Inspektor Ochrony Danych Osobowych) that regularly looked into complaints. In practice it turned out to work great, local businesses easily complied with the law, and nobody saw this as a huge hassle in the two decades of the application of the law. I find it hard to believe that it's going to get much worse than that with GDPR. Many companies are just overreacting here really.
    - JumpCrisscross 8y ago
      > before GDPR we had so many problems with companies mishandling data that "a bit overblown" is not something that everyone would agree with GDPR should have had a minimum revenue threshold for the bulk of its requirements. Enforcement should have also been centralized in a single EU enforcer. A simple process for obtaining non-compulsory affirmative compliance certificates, for businesses at or below the revenue threshold, would have also been nice. > I find it hard to believe that it's going to get much worse than that with GDPR I see Facebook and Google gaining market share and failing to change their behavior. In addition, Europe is no longer a market one launches in simultaneously with the U.S. and Asia for most foreign businesses. This whole episode is deeply frustrating as I'm strongly anti-Facebook and pro-privacy rights. The degree to which the EU turned an opportunity to lead into a wholesale boondoggle is jaw-dropping.
      - bmer 8y ago
        > In addition, Europe is no longer a market one launches in simultaneously with the U.S. and Asia for most foreign businesses. Since that's a broad statement, would you care to back it up? > I see Facebook and Google gaining market share and failing to change their behavior. In addition, Europe is no longer a market one launches in simultaneously with the U.S. and Asia for most foreign businesses. Are you saying that Facebook and Google are not GDPR compliant, and that furthermore, the EU doesn't care that they are not GDPR compliant?

onetimemanytime 8y ago

>>Anyone can sue you over any civil law. Then teh courts decides. GDPR is not magically different. This is a straw man. Yeah, but in this case that "anyone" is not spending a dime of his own, instead the limitless resources of EU will be coming after you. By the time the court decides, virtually any small company will bankrupt.

oblio 8y ago
The EU has a budget about the size of the Romanian one, a country with a GDP of €200bn. Their budget is minuscule by country standards.
bmer 8y ago
Why the assumption that the EU won't side with you, and will definitely only side with the person making the claim? Certainly, if you're compliant, there's a very good chance that you'll get off the complaint, yeah?
elygre 8y ago
The limitless resources of the government is never applied to all laws. Regulatory institutions are budget constrained like the rest of us, and will prioritize what it considers to be the worst cases.