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[Slightly off-topic] There are a lot of people here talking about how it is impossible to find a job at one of the top investment banks without any connections

[Slightly off-topic] There are a lot of people here talking about how it is impossible to find a job at one of the top investment banks without any connections. Why do you need to have connections to land a job? Why aren't the best candidates filtered from the job application pipeline like it happens at all of the big tech companies? By requiring connections to get in, Investment Bankers are biasing their employee tool from "the best" to "the people that went to their school". Maybe that's intentional...

dchhugani 8y ago
Hey konschubert - understand what you're saying, but I'd strongly disagree that this is only a phenomenon in investment banking. Roughly ~65% of hires for all Fortune 500 companies come from employee referrals, and top companies in all domains continually compensate existing employees with bonuses for helping hire their friends (because they know them well). While it may be more prominent in some industries over others, connections matter everywhere. Instead of trying to change that reality, we're trying to find a solution that mimics parts of the magic that happens when your "insider" friend puts in a good word for you. If someone on The Lobby thinks you're a good fit for the industry, we're aiming for their "Rating" to help you get some of that benefit you might get if a friend on the inside referred you and vouched for you.
gringoDan 8y ago
[Slightly sarcastic, but my opinion based on working in banking for a 3 month internship and then bailing to tech after graduating from college.] At the lower levels, investment banking doesn't take much brainpower. Analysts spend 95% of the day: making PowerPoint slides, doing research online, or un-doing the changes they made the day before because the VP on the team didn't like the changes the Associate wanted. The most interesting part of the job (financial modeling) can be learned in a couple of weeks. And then the Managing Director will just tell you what they want the model to spit out and you fudge the numbers to make it happen. There aren't really 10x investment banking analysts like there are 10x engineers. In investment banking, once you know the basics of finance and get your foot in the door, the hiring becomes very behavioral. I've found that people want to hire other people they'd like to hang out with.
- dchhugani 8y ago
  This is very insightful and perceptive, especially for just doing a 3 month internship. I agree with pretty much all of it. However - you'll find most people hate IB for the same reasons, but also know their only way to more interesting roles like private equity, hedge funds, and more is to do investment banking first. Engineering is no doubt more challenging in many respects; IB after a certain point becomes more about endurance, politics, and being good at repetition. But it's still a high-paying job, a gateway to other more interesting careers, and at least for me, a good way to develop a crazy disciplined work ethic. I'm sure you can get many of those other ways too - just thought this was worth mentioning.
  - gringoDan 8y ago
    Completely agree with your analysis. Wish you the best of luck with the company, it seems like it could definitely add value in the space. Sidenote - might be able to help you with some introductions on the technical co-founder front. I'm NYC-based as well, contact info in my profile.
    - dchhugani 8y ago
      Thanks gringoDan! Reaching out to you now - really appreciate the help + kind words.
seige 8y ago
"Why aren't the best candidates filtered from the job application pipeline like it happens at all of the big tech companies?" I am sorry but this simply not true. Referrals based hiring is the norm in SV tech companies and I am not talking C-level, this is prevalent in even the rank-n-file roles. We are happier not rolling the dice on the stranger, skills be damned.
- dchhugani 8y ago
  exactly!
Terretta 8y ago
> “how hard it is to find jobs without connections” To developers — here’s a connection. I’m hiring 50+ startup-style engineers (mix of pure software, DevSecOps, and SRE) with 80th percentile abilities and current skills — no finance background necessary — right now in New York City. Send me a resume and a GitHub link. Notes: 1. You shouldn’t need insider info to get hired. Interviews should be collaborative, not gotcha. Both sides of table want to discover if this is the right thing, you only get there through directness, openness, truth. We bias to full disclosure to combat the usual information asymmetry between the big corporation and the single individual. The job matters to you a lot, “big co doesn’t care”. So we try to tilt in your favor. 2. Insider info — if you can think of a security (such as prevent, detect, automation, or operation) capability that AWS, Azure, GCP, or Kubernetes is missing, and describe to my head of security engineering how you would design and implement it, you’ll be on the top of the stack. To “The Lobby” — Consider the edge case where the company wants the candidate to know everything they need to know. If your model supports paying insiders, consider offering to donate to a non-profit such as the EFF instead.

dchhugani 8y ago

Hey konschubert - understand what you're saying, but I'd strongly disagree that this is only a phenomenon in investment banking. Roughly ~65% of hires for all Fortune 500 companies come from employee referrals, and top companies in all domains continually compensate existing employees with bonuses for helping hire their friends (because they know them well). While it may be more prominent in some industries over others, connections matter everywhere. Instead of trying to change that reality, we're trying to find a solution that mimics parts of the magic that happens when your "insider" friend puts in a good word for you. If someone on The Lobby thinks you're a good fit for the industry, we're aiming for their "Rating" to help you get some of that benefit you might get if a friend on the inside referred you and vouched for you.

gringoDan 8y ago

[Slightly sarcastic, but my opinion based on working in banking for a 3 month internship and then bailing to tech after graduating from college.] At the lower levels, investment banking doesn't take much brainpower. Analysts spend 95% of the day: making PowerPoint slides, doing research online, or un-doing the changes they made the day before because the VP on the team didn't like the changes the Associate wanted. The most interesting part of the job (financial modeling) can be learned in a couple of weeks. And then the Managing Director will just tell you what they want the model to spit out and you fudge the numbers to make it happen. There aren't really 10x investment banking analysts like there are 10x engineers. In investment banking, once you know the basics of finance and get your foot in the door, the hiring becomes very behavioral. I've found that people want to hire other people they'd like to hang out with.

dchhugani 8y ago
This is very insightful and perceptive, especially for just doing a 3 month internship. I agree with pretty much all of it. However - you'll find most people hate IB for the same reasons, but also know their only way to more interesting roles like private equity, hedge funds, and more is to do investment banking first. Engineering is no doubt more challenging in many respects; IB after a certain point becomes more about endurance, politics, and being good at repetition. But it's still a high-paying job, a gateway to other more interesting careers, and at least for me, a good way to develop a crazy disciplined work ethic. I'm sure you can get many of those other ways too - just thought this was worth mentioning.
- gringoDan 8y ago
  Completely agree with your analysis. Wish you the best of luck with the company, it seems like it could definitely add value in the space. Sidenote - might be able to help you with some introductions on the technical co-founder front. I'm NYC-based as well, contact info in my profile.
  - dchhugani 8y ago
    Thanks gringoDan! Reaching out to you now - really appreciate the help + kind words.

seige 8y ago

"Why aren't the best candidates filtered from the job application pipeline like it happens at all of the big tech companies?" I am sorry but this simply not true. Referrals based hiring is the norm in SV tech companies and I am not talking C-level, this is prevalent in even the rank-n-file roles. We are happier not rolling the dice on the stranger, skills be damned.

dchhugani 8y ago
exactly!

Terretta 8y ago

> “how hard it is to find jobs without connections” To developers — here’s a connection. I’m hiring 50+ startup-style engineers (mix of pure software, DevSecOps, and SRE) with 80th percentile abilities and current skills — no finance background necessary — right now in New York City. Send me a resume and a GitHub link. Notes: 1. You shouldn’t need insider info to get hired. Interviews should be collaborative, not gotcha. Both sides of table want to discover if this is the right thing, you only get there through directness, openness, truth. We bias to full disclosure to combat the usual information asymmetry between the big corporation and the single individual. The job matters to you a lot, “big co doesn’t care”. So we try to tilt in your favor. 2. Insider info — if you can think of a security (such as prevent, detect, automation, or operation) capability that AWS, Azure, GCP, or Kubernetes is missing, and describe to my head of security engineering how you would design and implement it, you’ll be on the top of the stack. To “The Lobby” — Consider the edge case where the company wants the candidate to know everything they need to know. If your model supports paying insiders, consider offering to donate to a non-profit such as the EFF instead.