4 ms·

> How they deliberately hire the weak, the afraid, the vulnerable. [citation needed]

EliRivers 8y ago
Here's one. https://www.waterstones.com/book/hired/james-bloodworth/9781786490148 https://www.waterstones.com/book/hired/james-bloodworth/9781... There's one source. Please don't buy if from Amazon. Read it, find more of your own sources, and if you disagree, please come back and we can have an adult discussion. Amazon warehouses are run like gulags. Need to go to the toilet? That's one demerit. Call in sick? One demerit. Be off sick without calling in? Three demerits. When you get to six you're fired. If I had an employer pull that on me, I'd walk on day one, and so would you. We're not weak. We're not vulnerable. They know who they need to recruit in order to do this. They pick areas full of people desperate for work. They go to places where they know they will have an effectively endless supply of desperate, vulnerable, fearful people that they can pay a pittance to while they exploit them. It's their strategy. That's how you can exploit people and use them, and their actions are not accidental. I upvoted you for engaging; what I have to say is very unpopular and most people just blank it and move on. Thank you.
- reverend_gonzo 8y ago
  > Please come back and we can have an adult discussion. > Amazon warehouses are run like gulags. You can't have an adult discussion when coming from rhetoric like this.
  - EliRivers 8y ago
    Address the claims, not the style.
    - krapp 8y ago
      Amazon employees too many people to effectively hire based on a strategy of exploiting only the "desperate, vulnerable and fearful," unless that set includes literally anyone in the minimum wage bracket. And if they were as strict as you describe ("Need to go to the toilet? That's one demerit. Call in sick? One demerit. Be off sick without calling in? Three demerits. When you get to six you're fired.") most employees would be fired within a month. Don't get me wrong - it's tedious, exploitative, exhausting work and I don't doubt any of the horror stories are true, but Amazon is also just a business like any other, and most of those stories are exceptions, not the rule. Amazon aren't drug dealers or vampires, they'll hire anyone who applies and passes a drug screen, and they'll work everyone as hard as they legally can. They're not as evil as you describe for the simple reason that being as evil as you describe would be bad business. Most of what sucks about working in an Amazon warehouse is normal for a lot of low wage and blue collar work in the US. Just look into what long haul truckers have to do to make ends meet sometimes.
      - EliRivers 8y ago
        Amazon has the second highest employee turnover rate of the fortune 500 companies. They do fire more people (and drive people to quit) at a significantly higher rate. There are claims from former employees that they have a deliberate policy of firing people at eleven months, before they have to start providing medical insurance and paid holidays. That's legal, and horrible, and every time you or I buy from Amazon, we're saving a few pennies on the misery of those employees. and they'll work everyone as hard as they legally can They sure do. They take care (mostly) to stay on the side of legal. I'm not saying what they're doing is illegal (although some of their anti-union activities sure do come close!). Just grotesque and horrible. Amazon employees too many people to effectively hire based on a strategy of exploiting only the "desperate, vulnerable and fearful," I disagree. They put their warehouses where there are large pools of desperate, vulnerable people. They do that because they want to employ those people. A great deal of effort is put into planning where to put those warehouses. They know what they're doing. They know that they're going to get employees who will put up with urinating in bottles because going to the toilet will get them fired. There's evidence that this is the case. You say it's not the case, but then what do you say about the evidence? Is that evidence manufactured? Are people doing it for the fun of urinating in bottles? If you're going to argue that it's not that strict, you need to deal with that evidence. There is a lot out there suggesting it's a horrible place to work, and workers saying it's worse than other warehouse jobs they've had (which would imply that your claim it's simply typically bad, as minimum wage jobs tend to be, isn't true).
  - noobermin 8y ago
    Regardless of their abrasive rhetoric, the accusations against amazon are upsetting. Stories of people running around the shop floor to keep KPI's up, people peeing in bottle since bathroom breaks would reduce their pay. It's horrific, Amazon warehouses are terrible.

Here's one. https://www.waterstones.com/book/hired/james-bloodworth/9781786490148 https://www.waterstones.com/book/hired/james-bloodworth/9781... There's one source. Please don't buy if from Amazon. Read it, find more of your own sources, and if you disagree, please come back and we can have an adult discussion. Amazon warehouses are run like gulags. Need to go to the toilet? That's one demerit. Call in sick? One demerit. Be off sick without calling in? Three demerits. When you get to six you're fired. If I had an employer pull that on me, I'd walk on day one, and so would you. We're not weak. We're not vulnerable. They know who they need to recruit in order to do this. They pick areas full of people desperate for work. They go to places where they know they will have an effectively endless supply of desperate, vulnerable, fearful people that they can pay a pittance to while they exploit them. It's their strategy. That's how you can exploit people and use them, and their actions are not accidental. I upvoted you for engaging; what I have to say is very unpopular and most people just blank it and move on. Thank you.

reverend_gonzo 8y ago
> Please come back and we can have an adult discussion. > Amazon warehouses are run like gulags. You can't have an adult discussion when coming from rhetoric like this.
- EliRivers 8y ago
  Address the claims, not the style.
  - krapp 8y ago
    Amazon employees too many people to effectively hire based on a strategy of exploiting only the "desperate, vulnerable and fearful," unless that set includes literally anyone in the minimum wage bracket. And if they were as strict as you describe ("Need to go to the toilet? That's one demerit. Call in sick? One demerit. Be off sick without calling in? Three demerits. When you get to six you're fired.") most employees would be fired within a month. Don't get me wrong - it's tedious, exploitative, exhausting work and I don't doubt any of the horror stories are true, but Amazon is also just a business like any other, and most of those stories are exceptions, not the rule. Amazon aren't drug dealers or vampires, they'll hire anyone who applies and passes a drug screen, and they'll work everyone as hard as they legally can. They're not as evil as you describe for the simple reason that being as evil as you describe would be bad business. Most of what sucks about working in an Amazon warehouse is normal for a lot of low wage and blue collar work in the US. Just look into what long haul truckers have to do to make ends meet sometimes.
    - EliRivers 8y ago
      Amazon has the second highest employee turnover rate of the fortune 500 companies. They do fire more people (and drive people to quit) at a significantly higher rate. There are claims from former employees that they have a deliberate policy of firing people at eleven months, before they have to start providing medical insurance and paid holidays. That's legal, and horrible, and every time you or I buy from Amazon, we're saving a few pennies on the misery of those employees. and they'll work everyone as hard as they legally can They sure do. They take care (mostly) to stay on the side of legal. I'm not saying what they're doing is illegal (although some of their anti-union activities sure do come close!). Just grotesque and horrible. Amazon employees too many people to effectively hire based on a strategy of exploiting only the "desperate, vulnerable and fearful," I disagree. They put their warehouses where there are large pools of desperate, vulnerable people. They do that because they want to employ those people. A great deal of effort is put into planning where to put those warehouses. They know what they're doing. They know that they're going to get employees who will put up with urinating in bottles because going to the toilet will get them fired. There's evidence that this is the case. You say it's not the case, but then what do you say about the evidence? Is that evidence manufactured? Are people doing it for the fun of urinating in bottles? If you're going to argue that it's not that strict, you need to deal with that evidence. There is a lot out there suggesting it's a horrible place to work, and workers saying it's worse than other warehouse jobs they've had (which would imply that your claim it's simply typically bad, as minimum wage jobs tend to be, isn't true).
- noobermin 8y ago
  Regardless of their abrasive rhetoric, the accusations against amazon are upsetting. Stories of people running around the shop floor to keep KPI's up, people peeing in bottle since bathroom breaks would reduce their pay. It's horrific, Amazon warehouses are terrible.