5 ms·

Your body is replenishing glycogen stores in your muscles and that happens much faster if carbs are consumed shortly after exercise.

ericcholis 8y ago
I've read that high level body builders will actually eat candy after a workout for the same effect. Also, ultra marathons will have mountain dew at aid stations for that immediate boost.
- LyndsySimon 8y ago
  If I understand completely, glycogen depletion is "the wall" that is referred to by cyclists as well.
  - bitexploder 8y ago
    Yeah there is interesting "math" you can do. But, for most people, your liver stores about 1200-1500 calories of glycogen. You have some in all of your muscles, etc. Marathon is right at the distance you can run and stay under "the wall". In fact, that is a key part of pacing. Finding your race pace to basically operate on glycogen for all but the last bit of it (1-2 miles) where you can just push/suffer through on will power. If you go out too hard, you burn glycogen too fast, hit the wall at 6 miles out... that is the suck. 6 miles can be an actual eternity when you hit the wall.
LyndsySimon 8y ago
If you're in ketosis before exercising, your body doesn't have those glycogen stores to begin with, right?
- bitexploder 8y ago
  That's right. You basically won't be able to do a cardio effort to your body's capabilities. Anyone that has ever run an ultra marathon is essentially operating in ketosis like state. You just burn more energy than your body can absorb so it is a combination of stored fat and incoming carbs/fat/protein that keep you moving. edit: Your body also slows down its nutrient absorption rate during any exercise as it diverts blood to your extremities and core body functions. So digestion is more of a challenge.
  - kbutler 8y ago
    Carbs are absolutely /not/ required for long-duration cardio. There are high-performing, low-carb, cardio athletes. For example: (first link off a google esarch) https://www.mensjournal.com/health-fitness/zach-bitter-100-mile-american-record-holder-he-also-eats-almost-no-carbs/ https://www.mensjournal.com/health-fitness/zach-bitter-100-m... Studies that show a drop in cardio performance from low-carb have been measuring in the adaptation period, before the body adapts to low-carb performance.
    - bitexploder 8y ago
      This is covered pretty thoroughly and with a much higher level of detail in Lore of Running (Noakes). Down to the biochemical level of what is actually going on as you adapt to a low / no-carb state. You have to be precise with what you mean by "long-duration" cardio. Up to Marathon level you simply won't be able to go as fast as a runner that has muscle glycogen. You won't find any examples of elite marathon runners performing at their peak on a no-carb diet. Somewhere right at, or shortly after, marathon distance for most runners you have used up your glycogen stores anyway, so a great portion of your ultra is going to be executed without a lot of carbs / easy glycogen anyway. I don't think anyone will dispute some runners can operate with no carbs, etc. So, it just makes sense to train your body to burn fats / body fat efficiently because that is where a big portion of your fuel comes from in an ultra. I can't remember the exact time period, but it only takes a few weeks to fully adapt to low/no carb diet where your body gets good at making energy from fat. The actual chemical process is really cool. You definitely lose your ability to do high performance shorter events at the peak of your body's capability (5K/10K, etc.). It is simply a less efficient process of creating the primary fuel your cells use to do their thing.
      - kbutler 8y ago
        You also have to be precise about what you mean by "elite". Definitely "most runners" don't fit that category, so saying "you simply won't be able to go as fast" is probably overgeneralizing. https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/the-running-blog/2016/jan/19/high-carb-or-high-fat-the-running-diet-debate https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/the-running-blog/20... “If you’re going to run a marathon under two hours and 10 minutes, then yes, you probably need lots of carbohydrate to be able to perform to such an intense level of activity, but once you’re slower than two and a half hours, I’m not really convinced you do.” Adaptation periods are probably 6 weeks, possibly longer to fully adapt, though adaptation appears progressive. And training low-carb can have benefits even if racing carb-loaded.

ericcholis 8y ago

I've read that high level body builders will actually eat candy after a workout for the same effect. Also, ultra marathons will have mountain dew at aid stations for that immediate boost.

LyndsySimon 8y ago
If I understand completely, glycogen depletion is "the wall" that is referred to by cyclists as well.
- bitexploder 8y ago
  Yeah there is interesting "math" you can do. But, for most people, your liver stores about 1200-1500 calories of glycogen. You have some in all of your muscles, etc. Marathon is right at the distance you can run and stay under "the wall". In fact, that is a key part of pacing. Finding your race pace to basically operate on glycogen for all but the last bit of it (1-2 miles) where you can just push/suffer through on will power. If you go out too hard, you burn glycogen too fast, hit the wall at 6 miles out... that is the suck. 6 miles can be an actual eternity when you hit the wall.

LyndsySimon 8y ago

If you're in ketosis before exercising, your body doesn't have those glycogen stores to begin with, right?

bitexploder 8y ago
That's right. You basically won't be able to do a cardio effort to your body's capabilities. Anyone that has ever run an ultra marathon is essentially operating in ketosis like state. You just burn more energy than your body can absorb so it is a combination of stored fat and incoming carbs/fat/protein that keep you moving. edit: Your body also slows down its nutrient absorption rate during any exercise as it diverts blood to your extremities and core body functions. So digestion is more of a challenge.
- kbutler 8y ago
  Carbs are absolutely /not/ required for long-duration cardio. There are high-performing, low-carb, cardio athletes. For example: (first link off a google esarch) https://www.mensjournal.com/health-fitness/zach-bitter-100-mile-american-record-holder-he-also-eats-almost-no-carbs/ https://www.mensjournal.com/health-fitness/zach-bitter-100-m... Studies that show a drop in cardio performance from low-carb have been measuring in the adaptation period, before the body adapts to low-carb performance.
  - bitexploder 8y ago
    This is covered pretty thoroughly and with a much higher level of detail in Lore of Running (Noakes). Down to the biochemical level of what is actually going on as you adapt to a low / no-carb state. You have to be precise with what you mean by "long-duration" cardio. Up to Marathon level you simply won't be able to go as fast as a runner that has muscle glycogen. You won't find any examples of elite marathon runners performing at their peak on a no-carb diet. Somewhere right at, or shortly after, marathon distance for most runners you have used up your glycogen stores anyway, so a great portion of your ultra is going to be executed without a lot of carbs / easy glycogen anyway. I don't think anyone will dispute some runners can operate with no carbs, etc. So, it just makes sense to train your body to burn fats / body fat efficiently because that is where a big portion of your fuel comes from in an ultra. I can't remember the exact time period, but it only takes a few weeks to fully adapt to low/no carb diet where your body gets good at making energy from fat. The actual chemical process is really cool. You definitely lose your ability to do high performance shorter events at the peak of your body's capability (5K/10K, etc.). It is simply a less efficient process of creating the primary fuel your cells use to do their thing.
    - kbutler 8y ago
      You also have to be precise about what you mean by "elite". Definitely "most runners" don't fit that category, so saying "you simply won't be able to go as fast" is probably overgeneralizing. https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/the-running-blog/2016/jan/19/high-carb-or-high-fat-the-running-diet-debate https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/the-running-blog/20... “If you’re going to run a marathon under two hours and 10 minutes, then yes, you probably need lots of carbohydrate to be able to perform to such an intense level of activity, but once you’re slower than two and a half hours, I’m not really convinced you do.” Adaptation periods are probably 6 weeks, possibly longer to fully adapt, though adaptation appears progressive. And training low-carb can have benefits even if racing carb-loaded.