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And how often do humvees get stuck anyway? I like the product, but it’s obviously wasteful. During the Iraq insurgency what was wanted was armor plating. Litera

And how often do humvees get stuck anyway? I like the product, but it’s obviously wasteful. During the Iraq insurgency what was wanted was armor plating. Literally just 1/4” slabs of steel. This is of a piece with the F-35.

Swizec 8y ago
Humvees get stuck a lot! The US donated (I’m sure with wink wink strings attached) to us, Slovenia, some years ago and it was quickly found that they are too large and cumbersome for our foresty mountanous terrain. They’d get stuck all the time on tiny roads or between trees. I think these days they’re used for paraded to show we have them but day to day the military keeps using their trusti Puchs from who knows when. Tiny and manouverable.
- qaq 8y ago
  US is not fighting in areas where getting stuck between trees is a big issue.
  - chiph 8y ago
    Except maybe the western European nations like Germany. But it may be that Germany has had USAEUR there long enough so that they have cut wider roads in their forests for military vehicles. I was stationed there when they were introduced to the theater in the 80's and they didn't have any significant problems.
  - gpm 8y ago
    Given how much money the US spends on its military I'd expect them to be prepared to fight just about anywhere. Certainly in "foresty mountanous terrain" since that isn't particularly rare. Exists inside of the US. Exists on both borders of the US. Etc. Producing a military optimized for "blowing up unsophisticated enemies in desserts" seems like a very shorted sighted way to spend the military budget. (None of the above should be taken as me defending spending so much on the military as a whole, just on the allocation of the budget within the military to all sorts of terrain when taking the size of the current budget as a given).
    - Amygaz 8y ago
      DARPA should fund the development of 74-Z speeder bikes, and nothing else!
    - jandrewrogers 8y ago
      The US military has divisions that specialize in "foresty mountainous terrain". There are parts of the world (and US) that are effectively inaccessible to any mechanized units and the US military has large combat units that are setup to operate effectively in those environments. Terrain that is prohibitive to mechanized units is traditionally the domain of "light infantry" divisions (e.g. 10th Mountain Division), distinct from mechanized infantry divisions. The US military has dedicated units and training facilities for virtually every environment on Earth.
      - ryanmarsh 8y ago
        Yes unfortunately that makes for some miserable training.
  - Swizec 8y ago
    They did in the mid 90’s when they participated in the balkan wars. A lot of jungle wars before that. I think the general desertiness of war theatres only applies in the last 30 years or so and is not likely to persist forever.
  - forapurpose 8y ago
    > US is not fighting in areas where getting stuck between trees is a big issue. They need equipment for future wars, which are very difficult to predict. Also, the military's main purpose is to deter enemies by having capability. Enemies would be thrilled if the US military couldn't operate in wooded areas.
  - ridgeguy 8y ago
    Today.
- blackrock 8y ago
  It sounds like you need an Imperial Walker instead. https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/8/88/Various_Imperial_walkers.png https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/8/88/Var... We can sell you some lightly used units from our last imperial war. They have excellent maintenance records. And comes with a 5 year, or 50,000 mile warranty, whichever comes first.
- saalweachter 8y ago
  I wouldn't be surprised if this is one reason why horses lasted so long in various armies.
starpilot 8y ago
I see the F-35 disinfo put out by the US DoD is still effective.
macintux 8y ago
Heck, just last year one was stranded in Montana for days. https://www.jqpublicblog.com/air-force-lacks-resources-retrieve-humvee-week-stuck-outside-nuclear-missile-silo/ https://www.jqpublicblog.com/air-force-lacks-resources-retri...
UncleEntity 8y ago
I saw one get stuck so bad in the sand it took three tanks to pull it out over in Saudi. Was sitting with the frame on the ground so no way to dig it out (trust me, they had us try).
- newnewpdro 8y ago
  > Was sitting with the frame on the ground so no way to dig it out (trust me, they had us try). A vehicle beached at the frame on sand is a very common occurrence in the desert, and it's fairly trivial to get out if you have a shovel, brains, and are physically well. It's just some work, but sand is incredibly easy to excavate by hand, even from underneath a vehicle.

Swizec 8y ago

Humvees get stuck a lot! The US donated (I’m sure with wink wink strings attached) to us, Slovenia, some years ago and it was quickly found that they are too large and cumbersome for our foresty mountanous terrain. They’d get stuck all the time on tiny roads or between trees. I think these days they’re used for paraded to show we have them but day to day the military keeps using their trusti Puchs from who knows when. Tiny and manouverable.

qaq 8y ago
US is not fighting in areas where getting stuck between trees is a big issue.
- chiph 8y ago
  Except maybe the western European nations like Germany. But it may be that Germany has had USAEUR there long enough so that they have cut wider roads in their forests for military vehicles. I was stationed there when they were introduced to the theater in the 80's and they didn't have any significant problems.
- gpm 8y ago
  Given how much money the US spends on its military I'd expect them to be prepared to fight just about anywhere. Certainly in "foresty mountanous terrain" since that isn't particularly rare. Exists inside of the US. Exists on both borders of the US. Etc. Producing a military optimized for "blowing up unsophisticated enemies in desserts" seems like a very shorted sighted way to spend the military budget. (None of the above should be taken as me defending spending so much on the military as a whole, just on the allocation of the budget within the military to all sorts of terrain when taking the size of the current budget as a given).
  - Amygaz 8y ago
    DARPA should fund the development of 74-Z speeder bikes, and nothing else!
  - jandrewrogers 8y ago
    The US military has divisions that specialize in "foresty mountainous terrain". There are parts of the world (and US) that are effectively inaccessible to any mechanized units and the US military has large combat units that are setup to operate effectively in those environments. Terrain that is prohibitive to mechanized units is traditionally the domain of "light infantry" divisions (e.g. 10th Mountain Division), distinct from mechanized infantry divisions. The US military has dedicated units and training facilities for virtually every environment on Earth.
    - ryanmarsh 8y ago
      Yes unfortunately that makes for some miserable training.
- Swizec 8y ago
  They did in the mid 90’s when they participated in the balkan wars. A lot of jungle wars before that. I think the general desertiness of war theatres only applies in the last 30 years or so and is not likely to persist forever.
- forapurpose 8y ago
  > US is not fighting in areas where getting stuck between trees is a big issue. They need equipment for future wars, which are very difficult to predict. Also, the military's main purpose is to deter enemies by having capability. Enemies would be thrilled if the US military couldn't operate in wooded areas.
- ridgeguy 8y ago
  Today.
blackrock 8y ago
It sounds like you need an Imperial Walker instead. https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/8/88/Various_Imperial_walkers.png https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/8/88/Var... We can sell you some lightly used units from our last imperial war. They have excellent maintenance records. And comes with a 5 year, or 50,000 mile warranty, whichever comes first.
saalweachter 8y ago
I wouldn't be surprised if this is one reason why horses lasted so long in various armies.

starpilot 8y ago

I see the F-35 disinfo put out by the US DoD is still effective.

macintux 8y ago

Heck, just last year one was stranded in Montana for days. https://www.jqpublicblog.com/air-force-lacks-resources-retrieve-humvee-week-stuck-outside-nuclear-missile-silo/ https://www.jqpublicblog.com/air-force-lacks-resources-retri...

UncleEntity 8y ago

I saw one get stuck so bad in the sand it took three tanks to pull it out over in Saudi. Was sitting with the frame on the ground so no way to dig it out (trust me, they had us try).

newnewpdro 8y ago
> Was sitting with the frame on the ground so no way to dig it out (trust me, they had us try). A vehicle beached at the frame on sand is a very common occurrence in the desert, and it's fairly trivial to get out if you have a shovel, brains, and are physically well. It's just some work, but sand is incredibly easy to excavate by hand, even from underneath a vehicle.