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I agree, they are obnoxious to use as classical scrollbars. They've also eliminated the ability to incrementally scroll by clicking above or below the bar, now

I agree, they are obnoxious to use as classical scrollbars. They've also eliminated the ability to incrementally scroll by clicking above or below the bar, now it jumps absolutely to the position you clicked! So when you miss the bar, and it jumps to wherever you clicked, it's unobvious how to get back to where you were before the misfire. No more arrow buttons to click on either. It's an egregious UX regression as a trackpoint-only user. My impression is that the GNOME devs are all using touchpads and/or scroll-wheels for scrolling now and don't click on scrollbars, so they prefer to not see them and couldn't care less about how hard it is to locate and operate them via clicking. Supposedly GNOME is the accessibility champion of FOSS desktops, but that might have more to do with the dismal state of FOSS desktops than anything else.

chriswarbo 8y ago
There are workarounds for this, e.g. `gtk-primary-button-warps-slider=false` in ~/.config/gtk-3.0/settings.ini But I agree that it is obnoxious. I still haven't found a working GTK3 theme which is (a) dark (b) not "flat" and (c) has usable scrollbars. XFCE-Dusk is almost there, but seems to have been broken by newer GTKs, so I'm currently using Vertex-Dark.
- newnewpdro 8y ago
  That helps, thanks, though I hear this kind of thing is going away in GTK4. The developers are actively hostile to retaining any functionality unused by the defaults, regardless of how impactful that functionality may be for the minority using them. I simply don't comprehend how one reconciles that attitude with accessibility needs, when accessibility is inherently giving a fuck about the minority. It might be a simple matter of scarcity in developer resources. I presume most of the people bitching about GTK/GNOME in forums like these are actually capable of hacking on the project but don't, myself included. So maybe we should just be more appreciative of what we do have, there's nothing to refund after all.
ris 8y ago
> My impression is that the GNOME devs are all using touchpads and/or scroll-wheels for scrolling now and don't click on scrollbars Except I've had a horrible experience with scroll wheels and GTK3 - it seems to very easily get confused about widget focus.

chriswarbo 8y ago

There are workarounds for this, e.g. `gtk-primary-button-warps-slider=false` in ~/.config/gtk-3.0/settings.ini But I agree that it is obnoxious. I still haven't found a working GTK3 theme which is (a) dark (b) not "flat" and (c) has usable scrollbars. XFCE-Dusk is almost there, but seems to have been broken by newer GTKs, so I'm currently using Vertex-Dark.

newnewpdro 8y ago
That helps, thanks, though I hear this kind of thing is going away in GTK4. The developers are actively hostile to retaining any functionality unused by the defaults, regardless of how impactful that functionality may be for the minority using them. I simply don't comprehend how one reconciles that attitude with accessibility needs, when accessibility is inherently giving a fuck about the minority. It might be a simple matter of scarcity in developer resources. I presume most of the people bitching about GTK/GNOME in forums like these are actually capable of hacking on the project but don't, myself included. So maybe we should just be more appreciative of what we do have, there's nothing to refund after all.

ris 8y ago

> My impression is that the GNOME devs are all using touchpads and/or scroll-wheels for scrolling now and don't click on scrollbars Except I've had a horrible experience with scroll wheels and GTK3 - it seems to very easily get confused about widget focus.