3 ms·

I will bite: "world class interfaces" - are you sure? I haven't seen any UI on the web that would at least resemble some interfaces from top end games from 10

by bitL 8y ago

I will bite: "world class interfaces" - are you sure? I haven't seen any UI on the web that would at least resemble some interfaces from top end games from 10 years ago that were arguably world class. All I can see lately are clunkers where I have to wait ~10s until the whole page loads and I can finally do something, often with terrible responsivity on a top end i9.

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
lucidone 8y ago
I suppose it depends how we're defining world class. An intensely graphical UI in a game may require the performance native code offers - in that case, absolutely, native will likely outshine the current web stack for developing that specific UI, because the web stack will likely introduce a noticeable difference (ie: lag). However, I think the essence of the 'good-ness' (usability, aesthetics, intuitiveness, whatever) in the majority of interfaces isn't in the extra 10 - 20% of performance you can squeeze out, but in its design. If we entertain that idea, and html/css/js allows you to implement that idea bang-on, and there's a huge ecosystem surrounding this tech in assisting those implementations, and generally page loads aren't ~10s (I haven't experienced that myself - anyone can write bad code in any language, however), what's the trouble?
- bitL 8y ago
  If a page contains multiple sections it often waits ~10s until it's usable and I have to wait looking at rotating busy signs (compare e.g. NHL.com and its previous version that loaded instantly). Lately I am also getting extremely upset when on a recent i5 NUC just vertically scrolling on a trivially looking page stutters and NUCs fan goes to overdrive. It's getting ridiculous. It's not like you can pan in 2D or 3D an move in any direction, doing creative things, it's just a silly looking page with some title, links on the right and some images and embedded videos (just a large preview pic) in the main body. Everything is getting extremely bloated. Can't wait until I need an overclocked Threadripper with 1Gbit Internet to see what the weather forecast is...
  - orange8 8y ago
    If your "world class" games from 10 years ago were online based, they'd have the same problem. So its not really the web tech you are against, its the client-server application model.
    - ori_b 8y ago
      So, your argument is that it's not the implementation, but that the technology itself is fundamentally broken.
      - orange8 8y ago
        That's not my argument, and I can see how it got misunderstood: mean to reply to the grandparent comment, which was comparing the responsiveness of a desktop app where all required resources are installed and locally available, to that of a web application. Whatever you build it with, if the data has to come down "through the wire" then you will wait..
        bitL 8y ago
        My objection was that the previous designs provided exactly the same real-time information, used client-server architecture as well, but were fast.

by bitL 8y ago

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

lucidone 8y ago

I suppose it depends how we're defining world class. An intensely graphical UI in a game may require the performance native code offers - in that case, absolutely, native will likely outshine the current web stack for developing that specific UI, because the web stack will likely introduce a noticeable difference (ie: lag). However, I think the essence of the 'good-ness' (usability, aesthetics, intuitiveness, whatever) in the majority of interfaces isn't in the extra 10 - 20% of performance you can squeeze out, but in its design. If we entertain that idea, and html/css/js allows you to implement that idea bang-on, and there's a huge ecosystem surrounding this tech in assisting those implementations, and generally page loads aren't ~10s (I haven't experienced that myself - anyone can write bad code in any language, however), what's the trouble?

bitL 8y ago
If a page contains multiple sections it often waits ~10s until it's usable and I have to wait looking at rotating busy signs (compare e.g. NHL.com and its previous version that loaded instantly). Lately I am also getting extremely upset when on a recent i5 NUC just vertically scrolling on a trivially looking page stutters and NUCs fan goes to overdrive. It's getting ridiculous. It's not like you can pan in 2D or 3D an move in any direction, doing creative things, it's just a silly looking page with some title, links on the right and some images and embedded videos (just a large preview pic) in the main body. Everything is getting extremely bloated. Can't wait until I need an overclocked Threadripper with 1Gbit Internet to see what the weather forecast is...
- orange8 8y ago
  If your "world class" games from 10 years ago were online based, they'd have the same problem. So its not really the web tech you are against, its the client-server application model.
  - ori_b 8y ago
    So, your argument is that it's not the implementation, but that the technology itself is fundamentally broken.
    - orange8 8y ago
      That's not my argument, and I can see how it got misunderstood: mean to reply to the grandparent comment, which was comparing the responsiveness of a desktop app where all required resources are installed and locally available, to that of a web application. Whatever you build it with, if the data has to come down "through the wire" then you will wait..
      - bitL 8y ago
        My objection was that the previous designs provided exactly the same real-time information, used client-server architecture as well, but were fast.