4 ms·

Our best devs are consistently people who don’t have CS degrees and have good creativity, patience, curiosity, and who have some code to show that isn’t buzzwor

by cirgue 8y ago

Our best devs are consistently people who don’t have CS degrees and have good creativity, patience, curiosity, and who have some code to show that isn’t buzzword-chasing nonsense.

RealityVoid 8y ago
I think it's even less than that. I think the critical element is interest. I think even an average individual can have valuable contributions to a codebase if: a) the requirements, what needs to be achieved and standards of quality are clear b) they are interested in contributing. That's it. I think the bar for software development is pretty low at the time being (but I'm not in the SF area, so maybe my outlook is myopic and limited to the local scene) and you can improve things noticeably if you just... care... and think things through. A feat quite hard in our days. Heck, some days, I can't make myself care,and sometimes I don't feel like pushing and doing things right no matter how much I wish I could. I _know_ I'm capable, I've done it before, had high focus spurts where I did stuff nobody else could. But I simply don't feel in lately. Sometimes it's hard to even push myself to do usefull things, and I'm pretty severe regarding my performance. So, caring about the end result, in our days, I think, is in pretty short supply. Much shorter than most people think.
- btschaegg 8y ago
  > [...] you can improve things noticeably if you just... care... and think things through [...] This. Also: What the blogpost highlights well in this regard is that since the "bar" is orthogonal to real world skills and/or motivation, not only will you reject great developers who do (or would) care, there's also some chance you gather others who don't instead. I'm also under the impression that "not caring" in this sense contributes largely to problems as those discussed here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17164728 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17164728 (i.e. just ship what the customer/boss wants, don't bother understanding the problems or think things through)
madamelic 8y ago
Another engineer at my company and I realized that most absurdly good engineers we know have art backgrounds (or just consider themselves artistic / creative). Our theory is that artists are used to working with the limitations of their medium and enjoying the challenge.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
sanderjd 8y ago
Speaking quite selfishly to be sure: please don't make the opposite mistake by biasing against folks with CS degrees! I agree with all of the positive attributes you mention, but lots of people who studied CS also display those traits.
jhall1468 8y ago
I mean, someone with a CS degree that has good creativity, patience and curiosity is likely to perform well too. These days, the degree gives you a common language and some foundational stuff (algorithms and data structures). 99% of the people I work with have CS degrees, but the other 1% aren't defined by their lack of a degree, they are defined by their ability to learn the language on their own time and that's valuable.
s2g 8y ago
Huh, maybe you just suck at hiring people with CS degrees.

by cirgue 8y ago

Our best devs are consistently people who don’t have CS degrees and have good creativity, patience, curiosity, and who have some code to show that isn’t buzzword-chasing nonsense.

RealityVoid 8y ago

I think it's even less than that. I think the critical element is interest. I think even an average individual can have valuable contributions to a codebase if: a) the requirements, what needs to be achieved and standards of quality are clear b) they are interested in contributing. That's it. I think the bar for software development is pretty low at the time being (but I'm not in the SF area, so maybe my outlook is myopic and limited to the local scene) and you can improve things noticeably if you just... care... and think things through. A feat quite hard in our days. Heck, some days, I can't make myself care,and sometimes I don't feel like pushing and doing things right no matter how much I wish I could. I _know_ I'm capable, I've done it before, had high focus spurts where I did stuff nobody else could. But I simply don't feel in lately. Sometimes it's hard to even push myself to do usefull things, and I'm pretty severe regarding my performance. So, caring about the end result, in our days, I think, is in pretty short supply. Much shorter than most people think.

btschaegg 8y ago
> [...] you can improve things noticeably if you just... care... and think things through [...] This. Also: What the blogpost highlights well in this regard is that since the "bar" is orthogonal to real world skills and/or motivation, not only will you reject great developers who do (or would) care, there's also some chance you gather others who don't instead. I'm also under the impression that "not caring" in this sense contributes largely to problems as those discussed here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17164728 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17164728 (i.e. just ship what the customer/boss wants, don't bother understanding the problems or think things through)

madamelic 8y ago

Another engineer at my company and I realized that most absurdly good engineers we know have art backgrounds (or just consider themselves artistic / creative). Our theory is that artists are used to working with the limitations of their medium and enjoying the challenge.

deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

sanderjd 8y ago

Speaking quite selfishly to be sure: please don't make the opposite mistake by biasing against folks with CS degrees! I agree with all of the positive attributes you mention, but lots of people who studied CS also display those traits.

jhall1468 8y ago

I mean, someone with a CS degree that has good creativity, patience and curiosity is likely to perform well too. These days, the degree gives you a common language and some foundational stuff (algorithms and data structures). 99% of the people I work with have CS degrees, but the other 1% aren't defined by their lack of a degree, they are defined by their ability to learn the language on their own time and that's valuable.

s2g 8y ago

Huh, maybe you just suck at hiring people with CS degrees.