3 ms·

Disagree, performance is a side-effect of type safety... it's main use is to prevent bugs and help devs reading code. Also we use Python for the library ecosyst

by welder 8y ago

Disagree, performance is a side-effect of type safety... it's main use is to prevent bugs and help devs reading code. Also we use Python for the library ecosystem, easy to read syntax etc. which Java will probably never match. For performance, use Go or Rust and get everything Java has plus an active modern community.

thermodynthrway 8y ago
Performance and type safety are absolutely linked. The only major reason JS is still 5-10x slower than Java is looseness of types preventing optimizations. The Java community is still vibrant and much larger than Go and Rust put together. Modern stuff like RxJava, Lombok, MapStruct, streams, Guava, Gson, Retrofit, DropWizard, Vert.x, etc... Make Java a breeze these days. The learning curve is just steep. And the Java ecosystem is easily larger than Python. Python may be nearly as popular now, but Java has been in the top three for nearly two decades. A lot of shops use "vanilla Java" out of ignorance without modern libraries and it's crufty as hell. It's similar to shops still using JQuery hacking vs those that have awakened and use React and Typescript, practically a different language
- outworlder 8y ago
  > And the Java ecosystem is easily larger than Python. Python may be nearly as popular now, but Java has been in the top three for nearly two decades. And we should not care in 2018. Let me use Rust or whatever, I'll call your Java-based service if I need to use it.
  - thermodynthrway 8y ago
    gRPC is a godsend
hodgesrm 8y ago
"modern." I hear that word a lot. What are the concrete benefits of those languages beyond subjective properties like readability? COBOL is readable if you work with it regularly. Just as an example the Golang scheme for managing package dependencies still leaves much to be desired compared to the maven ecosystem commonly used in Java projects.
- dolmen 8y ago
  > Just as an example the Golang scheme for managing package dependencies still leaves much to be desired compared to the maven ecosystem commonly used in Java projects. This is being fixed... https://research.swtch.com/vgo https://research.swtch.com/vgo

by welder 8y ago

thermodynthrway 8y ago

Performance and type safety are absolutely linked. The only major reason JS is still 5-10x slower than Java is looseness of types preventing optimizations. The Java community is still vibrant and much larger than Go and Rust put together. Modern stuff like RxJava, Lombok, MapStruct, streams, Guava, Gson, Retrofit, DropWizard, Vert.x, etc... Make Java a breeze these days. The learning curve is just steep. And the Java ecosystem is easily larger than Python. Python may be nearly as popular now, but Java has been in the top three for nearly two decades. A lot of shops use "vanilla Java" out of ignorance without modern libraries and it's crufty as hell. It's similar to shops still using JQuery hacking vs those that have awakened and use React and Typescript, practically a different language

outworlder 8y ago
> And the Java ecosystem is easily larger than Python. Python may be nearly as popular now, but Java has been in the top three for nearly two decades. And we should not care in 2018. Let me use Rust or whatever, I'll call your Java-based service if I need to use it.
- thermodynthrway 8y ago
  gRPC is a godsend

hodgesrm 8y ago

"modern." I hear that word a lot. What are the concrete benefits of those languages beyond subjective properties like readability? COBOL is readable if you work with it regularly. Just as an example the Golang scheme for managing package dependencies still leaves much to be desired compared to the maven ecosystem commonly used in Java projects.

dolmen 8y ago
> Just as an example the Golang scheme for managing package dependencies still leaves much to be desired compared to the maven ecosystem commonly used in Java projects. This is being fixed... https://research.swtch.com/vgo https://research.swtch.com/vgo