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All I'm saying is that the non-functioning state of ruby/rubygems on debian and/or ubuntu is not news. This is not something that Zed just uncovered that was pr

by tjogin 16y ago

All I'm saying is that the non-functioning state of ruby/rubygems on debian and/or ubuntu is not news. This is not something that Zed just uncovered that was previously unknown. Everybody in the Ruby community knows this, and has known it, for many years. Thus, Zed offering a polite "bug report" rather than bitch and moan about it probably wouldn't have been all that much more effective -- seeing as how it has remained in the current non-functioning state for many years.

davidw 16y ago
> Thus, Zed offering a polite "bug report" rather than bitch and moan about it probably wouldn't have been all that much more effective -- seeing as how it has remained in the current non-functioning state for many years. And trying to round up a lynch mob is more effective how?
- tjogin 16y ago
  Well, Zed seems to have created a bit of a stir, hasn't he? Compared to the previous total lack of a discussion over the last several years, it seems Zed's approach has been quite efficient.
  - davidw 16y ago
    Hot air does not fix bugs. Hard work does.
    - tjogin 16y ago
      The state of the ruby/rubygems distribution is clearly not viewed as a bug by its maintainers, which is why neither hard work nor a bug report will fix it. Let's give discussion and attention a go.
      - deleted 16y ago
        [deleted]
      - davidw 16y ago
        Did you read what Zed wrote? That's not discussion, that's threatening people. It won't work. Also, if you read the Debian guy's opinion, it is clear that, behind the scenes, and away from all the kerfluffle, people are doing work to improve the situation. Also, you people seem awfully sure of yourself. If you peruse the bug reports, you might find some interesting nuggets: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=588125 http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=588125 > - Do we want to disable gem update --system? I think that we should allow a way for the user to do it anyway. But don't let me disabuse you of your preconceived notions.
        tjogin 16y ago
        I'm sure they've been working on it for the past half decade. Maybe now it'll even get resolved.
        halostatue 16y ago
        The proposed solution (an environment variable) is crap. That any of the Debian maintainers think that it's a good idea is an indication of how badly broken the Debian process is, and I know that Lucas was trying to do a good thing there. I don't blame him, it's at least an attempt at a fix. There's already a working solution provided by Apple for Mac OS X and improved upon by the RubyGems team. There's concepts of vendor gems, system gems, user gems, and I think one other level. The Debian team has never considered it despite being told that it's there. The Debian team has also never offered patches that would help RubyGems come more in line with what Debian thinks it should be doing. Why should the RubyGems guys bother working with uncooperative Debian maintainers?

by tjogin 16y ago

davidw 16y ago

> Thus, Zed offering a polite "bug report" rather than bitch and moan about it probably wouldn't have been all that much more effective -- seeing as how it has remained in the current non-functioning state for many years. And trying to round up a lynch mob is more effective how?

tjogin 16y ago
Well, Zed seems to have created a bit of a stir, hasn't he? Compared to the previous total lack of a discussion over the last several years, it seems Zed's approach has been quite efficient.
- davidw 16y ago
  Hot air does not fix bugs. Hard work does.
  - tjogin 16y ago
    The state of the ruby/rubygems distribution is clearly not viewed as a bug by its maintainers, which is why neither hard work nor a bug report will fix it. Let's give discussion and attention a go.
    - deleted 16y ago
      [deleted]
    - davidw 16y ago
      Did you read what Zed wrote? That's not discussion, that's threatening people. It won't work. Also, if you read the Debian guy's opinion, it is clear that, behind the scenes, and away from all the kerfluffle, people are doing work to improve the situation. Also, you people seem awfully sure of yourself. If you peruse the bug reports, you might find some interesting nuggets: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=588125 http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=588125 > - Do we want to disable gem update --system? I think that we should allow a way for the user to do it anyway. But don't let me disabuse you of your preconceived notions.
      - tjogin 16y ago
        I'm sure they've been working on it for the past half decade. Maybe now it'll even get resolved.
      - halostatue 16y ago
        The proposed solution (an environment variable) is crap. That any of the Debian maintainers think that it's a good idea is an indication of how badly broken the Debian process is, and I know that Lucas was trying to do a good thing there. I don't blame him, it's at least an attempt at a fix. There's already a working solution provided by Apple for Mac OS X and improved upon by the RubyGems team. There's concepts of vendor gems, system gems, user gems, and I think one other level. The Debian team has never considered it despite being told that it's there. The Debian team has also never offered patches that would help RubyGems come more in line with what Debian thinks it should be doing. Why should the RubyGems guys bother working with uncooperative Debian maintainers?