4 ms·

>>> In Germany, Google started to delist news sites from their index. After traffic dropped, the publishers gave Google a license to link freely. Law defeated.

by wiz21c 8y ago

>>> In Germany, Google started to delist news sites from their index. After traffic dropped, the publishers gave Google a license to link freely. Law defeated. I don't know the detail but the way you put it seems very fair to me. Law protect publishers against Google, so they can say to Google "no", except that their interest is to say "yes". So they say "yes". Looks to me that even if the end result is the same, the publishers had a say. Without the law, Google takes whatever it wants without asking. Now, it has to ask. Looks fair to me.

izzydata 8y ago
I agree. Even though the end result is back where they started.
Asooka 8y ago
Except you always have a say in whether or not Google takes any part of your site. Google have always respected robots.txt and it's trivial to block your site, or parts of it, from being indexed and shown in searches.
- anilakar 8y ago
  Except you won't be able to delist content without first allowing their crawler to rummage your site and returning 404 to Googlebot. Happened to me - I wanted to delist a single URL because it was generating unwanted traffic but still keep it accessible to those who have a direct link.
delecti 8y ago
The fundamental mechanics of the internet are such that there's no sensible justification around having to ask. It inherently makes no sense to have to ask to link to something online, especially for a news site. If they don't want someone linking to them then there are ways to avoid being linked to (requiring accounts, one-time links, requiring specific referral metadata), but by putting something on the internet you are implicitly enabling and encouraging links.
benjaminl 8y ago
Google actually does ask, it is called robots.txt [0]. Robots.txt is the technical equivalent of asking nicely. If the publishers don't want Google using snippets of their articles or otherwise indexing their articles all publishers need to do is tell Google not to using robots.txt, no law needed [1]. This law won't hurt Google, they have the necessary lawyers and resources to deal with the ramifications. What this will hurt are the smaller search engines that don't have the same resources as Google. This law, if enacted, will end up giving more power to Google not less. For example, with the German law, Google was given a free license [2], but was DuckDuckGo given a license? As far as I can tell no. So all that changed is that Google has a license and its competitors don't. I can't see how this is a good thing for anybody but Google. It hurts consumers, reduces market choice and will end up hurting publishers. [0] - http://www.robotstxt.org/orig.html http://www.robotstxt.org/orig.html [1] - https://support.google.com/webmasters/answer/6062608 https://support.google.com/webmasters/answer/6062608 [2] - https://the-digital-reader.com/2014/10/22/german-publishers-cave-grant-google-free-permission-use-snippets-search-results/ https://the-digital-reader.com/2014/10/22/german-publishers-...
drchaos 8y ago
> Without the law, Google takes whatever it wants without asking Google News does not automatically take your content. You have to apply explicitely to get it included. For regular search, there's always robots.txt. Claiming that there are any media/content producers who get included into the index against their will is absurd propaganda. Of course they want to be listed. They just want money, and Google has money, so they "convince" local politicians to make Google pay them their "share". Just like the Mafia.
skj 8y ago
Laws that don't solve actual problems are a problem.
realusername 8y ago
> Without the law, Google takes whatever it wants without asking No it does not, you need a lot of steps to make your website available on Google News, it does not work by default.

by wiz21c 8y ago

izzydata 8y ago

I agree. Even though the end result is back where they started.

Asooka 8y ago

Except you always have a say in whether or not Google takes any part of your site. Google have always respected robots.txt and it's trivial to block your site, or parts of it, from being indexed and shown in searches.

anilakar 8y ago
Except you won't be able to delist content without first allowing their crawler to rummage your site and returning 404 to Googlebot. Happened to me - I wanted to delist a single URL because it was generating unwanted traffic but still keep it accessible to those who have a direct link.

delecti 8y ago

The fundamental mechanics of the internet are such that there's no sensible justification around having to ask. It inherently makes no sense to have to ask to link to something online, especially for a news site. If they don't want someone linking to them then there are ways to avoid being linked to (requiring accounts, one-time links, requiring specific referral metadata), but by putting something on the internet you are implicitly enabling and encouraging links.

benjaminl 8y ago

Google actually does ask, it is called robots.txt [0]. Robots.txt is the technical equivalent of asking nicely. If the publishers don't want Google using snippets of their articles or otherwise indexing their articles all publishers need to do is tell Google not to using robots.txt, no law needed [1]. This law won't hurt Google, they have the necessary lawyers and resources to deal with the ramifications. What this will hurt are the smaller search engines that don't have the same resources as Google. This law, if enacted, will end up giving more power to Google not less. For example, with the German law, Google was given a free license [2], but was DuckDuckGo given a license? As far as I can tell no. So all that changed is that Google has a license and its competitors don't. I can't see how this is a good thing for anybody but Google. It hurts consumers, reduces market choice and will end up hurting publishers. [0] - http://www.robotstxt.org/orig.html http://www.robotstxt.org/orig.html [1] - https://support.google.com/webmasters/answer/6062608 https://support.google.com/webmasters/answer/6062608 [2] - https://the-digital-reader.com/2014/10/22/german-publishers-cave-grant-google-free-permission-use-snippets-search-results/ https://the-digital-reader.com/2014/10/22/german-publishers-...

drchaos 8y ago

> Without the law, Google takes whatever it wants without asking Google News does not automatically take your content. You have to apply explicitely to get it included. For regular search, there's always robots.txt. Claiming that there are any media/content producers who get included into the index against their will is absurd propaganda. Of course they want to be listed. They just want money, and Google has money, so they "convince" local politicians to make Google pay them their "share". Just like the Mafia.

skj 8y ago

Laws that don't solve actual problems are a problem.

realusername 8y ago

> Without the law, Google takes whatever it wants without asking No it does not, you need a lot of steps to make your website available on Google News, it does not work by default.