4 ms·

I came here to say this, once you're calling a 9+ billion dollar company is 'startup' the word has no meaning.

s_dev 8y ago
Depends on the definition of startup and what definition is most meaningful to the user. I find the definition of startup: "A business in the early stages" very limited and not that useful. Lots of old school business folk and baby boomer use startup with this in mind. Paul Graham's definition is one where the number one priority is growth. A business in contrast the number one priority is the bottom line. Priorities are a good way to differentiate between companies because they're trade offs and are specific/measurable. Companies will make decisions that reveal their priorities even if they profess to adhering to other priorities.
- inerte 8y ago
  I like “an organization formed to search for a repeatable and scalable business model” If you’re selling water and expect to grow a lot, unless you’re selling water in a completely new way, are you really a startup?
  - jonbarker 8y ago
    There are three subcategories of innovation: product, process, and financial innovation. So you could be a water startup if your water is not differentiated but you have either some new way of financing the production of water or some new process for producing said water.
- eanzenberg 8y ago
  PG definition is a shitty definition. Many public and private businesses you ask will tell you their number one priority is growth. Startup by the literal name being used means a relatively new company. If you want to differentiate among the general public use "tech startup" instead.
  - ams6110 8y ago
    Agreed. If your company is 9 years old and making billions in revenue, it's not a startup. If it's still very growth-oriented, call it a growth-oriented corporation.
    - s_dev 8y ago
      People seem quick to provide criticism of definitions without presenting their own definition for reciprocated criticism. So far your definition so far is limited to just precluding anything greater or equal in age to 9 years or anything above 2 Billion in revenue. Typically what happens as companies scale is they switch priorities from being growth oriented to being a profit oriented one -- the reason being is not looking after bottom line is simply not sustainable. Focusing on growth at the expense of profitability is sustainable for early stage companies as a someone will pay to see if the growth can be realized.
      - coldtea 8y ago
        >People seem quick to provide criticism of definitions without presenting their own definition for reciprocated criticism. So far your definition so far is limited to just precluding anything greater or equal in age to 9 years or anything above 2 Billion in revenue. Small, less than 4 years of age, under 100 people, aspiring and trying to find its way. Could be VC backed eyeballs-oriented, or regular slower-growth company. Stripe is nothing like that today.
      - gamblor956 8y ago
        PG's definition is but one bastardization of the word "startup" and it is by far the most useless one. A startup is a company that hasn't identified a profitable business model. Legally, the definition is further restricted to a company which hasn't begun revenue-generating activities. It's okay to be a startup for a few months while you're getting everything together and launching. Once you've launched, if you're still a startup, that's an embarrassment--it means your product (or products) isn't generating sufficient revenue to be a real business.
- jryan49 8y ago
  The entire economy's goal is growth, seems pretty catch all.
- earenndil 8y ago
  In that case, amazon, which is near the top of the s&p 500, and makes hundreds of billions of dollars in revenue, is a startup.
jonknee 8y ago
What is your cutoff? Bird is not yet a year old and is definitely a startup, but has a $2b valuation. It's a wacky world.
- gamblor956 8y ago
  Startup actually has a legal definition, generally referring to a company that has not yet commenced its revenue-generating activities. Then, the term was extended to mean a company that had not yet identified a profitable business model but was (presumably) working toward it. Now, it's whatever the tech bros want it to be so that they can tell women that they work for a startup.
  - jonknee 8y ago
    Well then by all means please link me to the law that states what a startup is!

Depends on the definition of startup and what definition is most meaningful to the user. I find the definition of startup: "A business in the early stages" very limited and not that useful. Lots of old school business folk and baby boomer use startup with this in mind. Paul Graham's definition is one where the number one priority is growth. A business in contrast the number one priority is the bottom line. Priorities are a good way to differentiate between companies because they're trade offs and are specific/measurable. Companies will make decisions that reveal their priorities even if they profess to adhering to other priorities.

inerte 8y ago
I like “an organization formed to search for a repeatable and scalable business model” If you’re selling water and expect to grow a lot, unless you’re selling water in a completely new way, are you really a startup?
- jonbarker 8y ago
  There are three subcategories of innovation: product, process, and financial innovation. So you could be a water startup if your water is not differentiated but you have either some new way of financing the production of water or some new process for producing said water.
eanzenberg 8y ago
PG definition is a shitty definition. Many public and private businesses you ask will tell you their number one priority is growth. Startup by the literal name being used means a relatively new company. If you want to differentiate among the general public use "tech startup" instead.
- ams6110 8y ago
  Agreed. If your company is 9 years old and making billions in revenue, it's not a startup. If it's still very growth-oriented, call it a growth-oriented corporation.
  - s_dev 8y ago
    People seem quick to provide criticism of definitions without presenting their own definition for reciprocated criticism. So far your definition so far is limited to just precluding anything greater or equal in age to 9 years or anything above 2 Billion in revenue. Typically what happens as companies scale is they switch priorities from being growth oriented to being a profit oriented one -- the reason being is not looking after bottom line is simply not sustainable. Focusing on growth at the expense of profitability is sustainable for early stage companies as a someone will pay to see if the growth can be realized.
    - coldtea 8y ago
      >People seem quick to provide criticism of definitions without presenting their own definition for reciprocated criticism. So far your definition so far is limited to just precluding anything greater or equal in age to 9 years or anything above 2 Billion in revenue. Small, less than 4 years of age, under 100 people, aspiring and trying to find its way. Could be VC backed eyeballs-oriented, or regular slower-growth company. Stripe is nothing like that today.
    - gamblor956 8y ago
      PG's definition is but one bastardization of the word "startup" and it is by far the most useless one. A startup is a company that hasn't identified a profitable business model. Legally, the definition is further restricted to a company which hasn't begun revenue-generating activities. It's okay to be a startup for a few months while you're getting everything together and launching. Once you've launched, if you're still a startup, that's an embarrassment--it means your product (or products) isn't generating sufficient revenue to be a real business.
jryan49 8y ago
The entire economy's goal is growth, seems pretty catch all.
earenndil 8y ago
In that case, amazon, which is near the top of the s&p 500, and makes hundreds of billions of dollars in revenue, is a startup.

jonknee 8y ago

What is your cutoff? Bird is not yet a year old and is definitely a startup, but has a $2b valuation. It's a wacky world.

gamblor956 8y ago
Startup actually has a legal definition, generally referring to a company that has not yet commenced its revenue-generating activities. Then, the term was extended to mean a company that had not yet identified a profitable business model but was (presumably) working toward it. Now, it's whatever the tech bros want it to be so that they can tell women that they work for a startup.
- jonknee 8y ago
  Well then by all means please link me to the law that states what a startup is!