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I think at some point the EU market might become something similar to China, where you don't offer your services at first, and once your service already becomes

by Zyst 8y ago

I think at some point the EU market might become something similar to China, where you don't offer your services at first, and once your service already becomes successful in the rest of the world you consider porting it over, if a clone hasn't popped up and grabbed market share in the meantime. Which might not necessarily be a huge negative for the users inside the EU, aside from people being unable to access things they want to access because of where they live. Which I'm hugely opposed to, in several ways. Either way, I'm conflicted about all the stuff going on in the EU. I haven't made up my mind as to which side I fall on, but I do hope they tread carefully.

ealhad 8y ago
As a EU citizen, I sure hope so. edit: my message seems to be confusing. I was answering the last sentence of the parent comment, saying that I hope as well that EU doesn't screw up.
- semperdark 8y ago
  I'm sincerely interested in the motivation that leads to hoping your government controls what you may read. Is it protectionism? Shielding people from radicalization?
  - ealhad 8y ago
    > but I do hope they tread carefully. That's what I was referring to. I definitely don't want the government — any government — to control what I may read, or even to know it.
    - semperdark 8y ago
      Ah, I see now - sorry for the misunderstanding. I was so surprised by the post that I didn't stop to consider alternative meanings.
- krick 8y ago
  I'm not sure if it would we a screw up. I mean, I actually liked early 2000-s, when Internet was kind of place of reigning anarchy as if there was no government and evil corporations, but let's just face it: it's long gone. Maybe there will be something else to offer the same kind of experience in the future, but it will never be the Web again, it's dead, taken by the enemy. Parents are home again. So, speaking about the least evil, you know, I would be actually glad, if Facebook (as it is now) would never enter the EU — and maybe somewhere across the ocean whole nations would be enslaved by it, I wouldn't care, because I don't have to use it, since my friends, local businesses and events don't force me to. In fact, it seems that it's finally the case when people around might have to be "protected", since they cannot make the right choice themselves, and push me to it, as a consequence. So, being quite a libertarian myself, given the imperfect situation I find myself in, I'm not sure I mind some government interference. I actually hate all these pop-up banners warning me about the cookie usage, and I'm not sure if GDPR (being vague and undefinitive it is) will turn out to be a good thing, and I sure hate this copyright filters thing. But I kind of like EU trying to force Internet-businesses to behave.
  - ealhad 8y ago
    Oh, it seems I was unclear again ;) I will pay attention to the decision the EU takes, as a citizen. And I hope that I agree with them — “screwing up” essentially meant doing something I disagree with. Just like you, I don't know if GDPR will be a good thing; but at least it seems to be written with the citizens' well-being in mind, and that’s a big change. > I would be actually glad, if Facebook (as it is now) would never enter the EU So would I.
vezycash 8y ago
I've read of a riot that happened in 17th century France because bakers went on strike or holidays causing bread scarcity. The government responded putting laws to make sure bread's always available to prevent a revolution. I wonder what EU citizens would do if new sites blocked EU by default. It's a pity that France (a key instigator of this saga) wouldn't be affected much unlike English speaking countries.
- ealhad 8y ago
  I think the riot you are thinking of took place more than sixty years ago :) What kind of site would block EU by default? If EU is a big part of the site's audience, they probably wouldn't close it, and if it's not, well, there wouldn't be enough people complaining. If a site decides to do this, it's most likely one I don't want to read. I would still be upset.
  - fergbrain 8y ago
    Many sites in the US have now blocked the EU because of GDPR. For example: https://www.latimes.com https://www.latimes.com Edit: corrected URL
    - ealhad 8y ago
      I know, I was thinking about sites like this one. I don't think I'm missing a lot, the internet is huge.
      - fergbrain 8y ago
        We need good news reporting in the US right now (I’m an expat) and losing easy access (I have a VPN to bypass) to sites like LA Times (#4 in the US by circulation) may not seem like a big deal, but I believe is a harbinger things to come. It’s also just one example (search for “shutdown because of GDPR” and there are many more tales) and doesn’t account for future companies that now have to factor GDPR into their business plan and may not (likely won’t?) bring their services to Europe.
bri3d 8y ago
This is how the EU market has worked, in many ways, for years. There have always been moats due especially to localization and payment gateway issues. See: the legendary Samwer Bros clone companies. Certainly GDPR only increases the width of these moats, but the market dynamic isn't much new.

by Zyst 8y ago

ealhad 8y ago

As a EU citizen, I sure hope so. edit: my message seems to be confusing. I was answering the last sentence of the parent comment, saying that I hope as well that EU doesn't screw up.

semperdark 8y ago
I'm sincerely interested in the motivation that leads to hoping your government controls what you may read. Is it protectionism? Shielding people from radicalization?
- ealhad 8y ago
  > but I do hope they tread carefully. That's what I was referring to. I definitely don't want the government — any government — to control what I may read, or even to know it.
  - semperdark 8y ago
    Ah, I see now - sorry for the misunderstanding. I was so surprised by the post that I didn't stop to consider alternative meanings.
krick 8y ago
I'm not sure if it would we a screw up. I mean, I actually liked early 2000-s, when Internet was kind of place of reigning anarchy as if there was no government and evil corporations, but let's just face it: it's long gone. Maybe there will be something else to offer the same kind of experience in the future, but it will never be the Web again, it's dead, taken by the enemy. Parents are home again. So, speaking about the least evil, you know, I would be actually glad, if Facebook (as it is now) would never enter the EU — and maybe somewhere across the ocean whole nations would be enslaved by it, I wouldn't care, because I don't have to use it, since my friends, local businesses and events don't force me to. In fact, it seems that it's finally the case when people around might have to be "protected", since they cannot make the right choice themselves, and push me to it, as a consequence. So, being quite a libertarian myself, given the imperfect situation I find myself in, I'm not sure I mind some government interference. I actually hate all these pop-up banners warning me about the cookie usage, and I'm not sure if GDPR (being vague and undefinitive it is) will turn out to be a good thing, and I sure hate this copyright filters thing. But I kind of like EU trying to force Internet-businesses to behave.
- ealhad 8y ago
  Oh, it seems I was unclear again ;) I will pay attention to the decision the EU takes, as a citizen. And I hope that I agree with them — “screwing up” essentially meant doing something I disagree with. Just like you, I don't know if GDPR will be a good thing; but at least it seems to be written with the citizens' well-being in mind, and that’s a big change. > I would be actually glad, if Facebook (as it is now) would never enter the EU So would I.

vezycash 8y ago

I've read of a riot that happened in 17th century France because bakers went on strike or holidays causing bread scarcity. The government responded putting laws to make sure bread's always available to prevent a revolution. I wonder what EU citizens would do if new sites blocked EU by default. It's a pity that France (a key instigator of this saga) wouldn't be affected much unlike English speaking countries.

ealhad 8y ago
I think the riot you are thinking of took place more than sixty years ago :) What kind of site would block EU by default? If EU is a big part of the site's audience, they probably wouldn't close it, and if it's not, well, there wouldn't be enough people complaining. If a site decides to do this, it's most likely one I don't want to read. I would still be upset.
- fergbrain 8y ago
  Many sites in the US have now blocked the EU because of GDPR. For example: https://www.latimes.com https://www.latimes.com Edit: corrected URL
  - ealhad 8y ago
    I know, I was thinking about sites like this one. I don't think I'm missing a lot, the internet is huge.
    - fergbrain 8y ago
      We need good news reporting in the US right now (I’m an expat) and losing easy access (I have a VPN to bypass) to sites like LA Times (#4 in the US by circulation) may not seem like a big deal, but I believe is a harbinger things to come. It’s also just one example (search for “shutdown because of GDPR” and there are many more tales) and doesn’t account for future companies that now have to factor GDPR into their business plan and may not (likely won’t?) bring their services to Europe.

bri3d 8y ago

This is how the EU market has worked, in many ways, for years. There have always been moats due especially to localization and payment gateway issues. See: the legendary Samwer Bros clone companies. Certainly GDPR only increases the width of these moats, but the market dynamic isn't much new.