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I think the biggest scam in bitcoin is using the motte-and-bailey argument that ”blockchains have real-world use”, and ”already existing bitcoins are worth tens

by nikanj 8y ago

I think the biggest scam in bitcoin is using the motte-and-bailey argument that ”blockchains have real-world use”, and ”already existing bitcoins are worth tens of thousands each”. The only things you can do with already mined blockchain blocks are selling them, or hoarding them. Their immutability is their biggest selling point, after all.

omarchowdhury 8y ago
The biggest scam in Bitcoin has been people with a vested interest in it throwing around price predictions since the beginning, and that being the only media narrative propelled. If the conversation is about how human society can evolve with this new level and kind of coordination, then we may fare better.
john_moscow 8y ago
The real-world use is the transfer of value. From optimists to opportunists.
- meh2frdf 8y ago
  Best description yet!
coralreef 8y ago
Are you certain you understand blockchains and cryptocurrencies? Ex: The only things you can do with already mined blockchain blocks are selling them, or hoarding them. You don't actually do anything with blocks. Blocks contain transaction data for the network, confirmed by miners who play hash games for block rewards. I think you mean the actual coins that come as block rewards, aka Satoshis / Bitcoin. Are you familiar with decentralization and developing apps on things like Ethereum? Or IPFS?
- Jdam 8y ago
  Are you familiar with the fact that _still_ , after years of hype and hundreads of billions of $ in the system, there is not a single app that has reached mainstream adoption? In fact, interest is fading without any major breakthrough achieved. I actually do run a {insert random blockchain based hyped decentral protocol here} app and I can see that absolutely nothing has happened or changed during the last year or so.
- JoeSmithson 8y ago
  Cryptocurrencies are really not that hard to understand. Without a doubt, they are better understood on average among HN readers than among cryptocurrency owners, and yet, it is the only subject where expressing doubt over it's worth always gets you hit with "Well maybe you're just not enlightened enough??"
  - yorwba 8y ago
    > expressing doubt over it's worth always gets you hit with "Well maybe you're just not enlightened enough??" I also doubt that blockchains contribute anything of value for most applications that are currently being tried out, but I also felt that "selling blockchain blocks" was an odd way to phrase it. It's a bit like someone claiming that a perpetuum mobile is impossible because "movement consumes energy and eventually it will run out". You can't tell whether they have the correct idea about conservation of energy and momentum or whether they actually believe that moving at a constant speed would constantly require energy even without friction.
  - al_chemist 8y ago
    Without a doubt, average HN reader knows more about cryptocurrency than average cryptocurrency owner, knows more about farming than average farmer, knows more about biology than average bioscientist. Why? It's obvious, isn't it? \s Cryptocurrencies aside, currencies are hard to understand. It's not "you trade money for stuff, duh!". It's how USA can print dollars to import stuff from China year by year without giving anything back. It's who prints money. It's how come printing dollars makes existing ones less valuable while also creating debt. How does independent currency affect debt-based currencies? It's easy to be elitist. We know about computers more than average Joe, so we are experts on computer's money, but IMO cryptocurrencies are more currencies than crypto. And currency part is harder to understand than crypto part.

by nikanj 8y ago

omarchowdhury 8y ago

The biggest scam in Bitcoin has been people with a vested interest in it throwing around price predictions since the beginning, and that being the only media narrative propelled. If the conversation is about how human society can evolve with this new level and kind of coordination, then we may fare better.

john_moscow 8y ago

The real-world use is the transfer of value. From optimists to opportunists.

meh2frdf 8y ago
Best description yet!

coralreef 8y ago

Are you certain you understand blockchains and cryptocurrencies? Ex: The only things you can do with already mined blockchain blocks are selling them, or hoarding them. You don't actually do anything with blocks. Blocks contain transaction data for the network, confirmed by miners who play hash games for block rewards. I think you mean the actual coins that come as block rewards, aka Satoshis / Bitcoin. Are you familiar with decentralization and developing apps on things like Ethereum? Or IPFS?

Jdam 8y ago
Are you familiar with the fact that _still_ , after years of hype and hundreads of billions of $ in the system, there is not a single app that has reached mainstream adoption? In fact, interest is fading without any major breakthrough achieved. I actually do run a {insert random blockchain based hyped decentral protocol here} app and I can see that absolutely nothing has happened or changed during the last year or so.
JoeSmithson 8y ago
Cryptocurrencies are really not that hard to understand. Without a doubt, they are better understood on average among HN readers than among cryptocurrency owners, and yet, it is the only subject where expressing doubt over it's worth always gets you hit with "Well maybe you're just not enlightened enough??"
- yorwba 8y ago
  > expressing doubt over it's worth always gets you hit with "Well maybe you're just not enlightened enough??" I also doubt that blockchains contribute anything of value for most applications that are currently being tried out, but I also felt that "selling blockchain blocks" was an odd way to phrase it. It's a bit like someone claiming that a perpetuum mobile is impossible because "movement consumes energy and eventually it will run out". You can't tell whether they have the correct idea about conservation of energy and momentum or whether they actually believe that moving at a constant speed would constantly require energy even without friction.
- al_chemist 8y ago
  Without a doubt, average HN reader knows more about cryptocurrency than average cryptocurrency owner, knows more about farming than average farmer, knows more about biology than average bioscientist. Why? It's obvious, isn't it? \s Cryptocurrencies aside, currencies are hard to understand. It's not "you trade money for stuff, duh!". It's how USA can print dollars to import stuff from China year by year without giving anything back. It's who prints money. It's how come printing dollars makes existing ones less valuable while also creating debt. How does independent currency affect debt-based currencies? It's easy to be elitist. We know about computers more than average Joe, so we are experts on computer's money, but IMO cryptocurrencies are more currencies than crypto. And currency part is harder to understand than crypto part.