5 ms·

I’m very confused about the legal status of ketamine in the United States. It’s seemingly illegal (schedule 1?) but also there have been stories about ketamine

I’m very confused about the legal status of ketamine in the United States. It’s seemingly illegal (schedule 1?) but also there have been stories about ketamine therapy for depression symptoms and now this? I don’t understand US drug laws.

stochastic_monk 8y ago
Schedule III. Of course, there are studies on cannabis/psilocybin, which are both schedule I. It's still a terrible and terrifying drug for subduing people.
- drb91 8y ago
  I’m not terribly familiar with ketamine. Thorazine is often used for this purpose, as an injection, a gas, or a pill. How does it compare in how it affects the target? I’m emphatically not in favor of police using this except as an alternative to other types of violence, but sedation is useful in other contexts.
  - stochastic_monk 8y ago
    Thorazine is an antipsychotic, for schizophrenia, stimulant overdoses, and stuff like PCP. Ketamine is more of a dissociative; it's a little like long-lasting injectable nitrous oxide. It causes hallucinations, but more like a loss of connection from reality than seeing things that aren't there.
- JshWright 8y ago
  > It's still a terrible and terrifying drug for subduing people. It is commonly use for procedural sedation (i.e. sedating someone so you can reduce a joint dislocation).
  - stochastic_monk 8y ago
    Right, but when is using procedural sedation on unconsenting suspects acceptable?
    - JshWright 8y ago
      When they pose a threat to themselves or others.
      - stochastic_monk 8y ago
        That’s fair. I just don’t trust police to be good judges of that. We can’t even get them to stop obstructing investigations by turning off their body cameras.
        JshWright 8y ago
        Sure, but that doesn't make it "terrible and terrifying". It is literally life saving in certain circumstances.
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]
notadoc 8y ago
Ketamine is an anesthetic with broadly valid medical use. There are many similar substances which are scheduled and controlled.
- Synaesthesia 8y ago
  This is correct, it's actually a very safe drug, it's on the WHO list of essential medicines, it's given to infants, obviously in a appropriate setting. Very questionable that some people had to be resuscitated because they were given Ketamine while handcuffed - already a strain on your breathing and heart, when it's a depressant.
  - jfk13 8y ago
    Some years ago, I had a close friend who got drawn into ketamine (ab)use and spent an extended period seriously addicted to it. Having watched the devastation it wrought in her and her family's lives, and the struggle it took to break its hold, I find this highly disturbing. Yes, ketamine has its uses, but it also carries real risks and should not be used without proper controls and medical oversight.
    - Synaesthesia 8y ago
      Yeah it’s quite addictive. But for example anyone who undergoes surgery gets given opiates which are also highly addictive. That doesn’t result in millions of people suddenly being addicted.
Jugglerofworlds 8y ago
I've had ketamine infusions for depression. At the ketamine clinics, the drug is administered by an anesthesiologist, and insurance does not cover the cost since the drug is not FDA approved for depression.

stochastic_monk 8y ago

Schedule III. Of course, there are studies on cannabis/psilocybin, which are both schedule I. It's still a terrible and terrifying drug for subduing people.

drb91 8y ago
I’m not terribly familiar with ketamine. Thorazine is often used for this purpose, as an injection, a gas, or a pill. How does it compare in how it affects the target? I’m emphatically not in favor of police using this except as an alternative to other types of violence, but sedation is useful in other contexts.
- stochastic_monk 8y ago
  Thorazine is an antipsychotic, for schizophrenia, stimulant overdoses, and stuff like PCP. Ketamine is more of a dissociative; it's a little like long-lasting injectable nitrous oxide. It causes hallucinations, but more like a loss of connection from reality than seeing things that aren't there.
JshWright 8y ago
> It's still a terrible and terrifying drug for subduing people. It is commonly use for procedural sedation (i.e. sedating someone so you can reduce a joint dislocation).
- stochastic_monk 8y ago
  Right, but when is using procedural sedation on unconsenting suspects acceptable?
  - JshWright 8y ago
    When they pose a threat to themselves or others.
    - stochastic_monk 8y ago
      That’s fair. I just don’t trust police to be good judges of that. We can’t even get them to stop obstructing investigations by turning off their body cameras.
      - JshWright 8y ago
        Sure, but that doesn't make it "terrible and terrifying". It is literally life saving in certain circumstances.

deleted 8y ago

[deleted]

notadoc 8y ago

Ketamine is an anesthetic with broadly valid medical use. There are many similar substances which are scheduled and controlled.

Synaesthesia 8y ago
This is correct, it's actually a very safe drug, it's on the WHO list of essential medicines, it's given to infants, obviously in a appropriate setting. Very questionable that some people had to be resuscitated because they were given Ketamine while handcuffed - already a strain on your breathing and heart, when it's a depressant.
- jfk13 8y ago
  Some years ago, I had a close friend who got drawn into ketamine (ab)use and spent an extended period seriously addicted to it. Having watched the devastation it wrought in her and her family's lives, and the struggle it took to break its hold, I find this highly disturbing. Yes, ketamine has its uses, but it also carries real risks and should not be used without proper controls and medical oversight.
  - Synaesthesia 8y ago
    Yeah it’s quite addictive. But for example anyone who undergoes surgery gets given opiates which are also highly addictive. That doesn’t result in millions of people suddenly being addicted.

Jugglerofworlds 8y ago

I've had ketamine infusions for depression. At the ketamine clinics, the drug is administered by an anesthesiologist, and insurance does not cover the cost since the drug is not FDA approved for depression.