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Twitter Lite and Airbnb are obvious examples not behind a login. I'm sure there are countless good examples in this list: https://github.com/facebook/react/wik

Twitter Lite and Airbnb are obvious examples not behind a login. I'm sure there are countless good examples in this list: https://github.com/facebook/react/wiki/Sites-Using-React https://github.com/facebook/react/wiki/Sites-Using-React But React and other SPA libraries will always excel more for more complex UIs, those sorts of things tend to be behind logins.

TekMol 8y ago
Twitter lite: Where is that? AirBnB: I love AirBnBs service, but I totally hate the UI. It's slow and clunky and gets into the way like nothing else. A single page of a room loads over 5MB of data, scrollinig is laggy, everything feels just terrible.
- allover 8y ago
  > Twitter lite: Where is that? https://mobile.twitter.com https://mobile.twitter.com > AirBnB ... Maybe not the best example. I think they still have a lot of legacy cruft they need to fix. I still think their homepage/search UX is pretty good. And like someone else said, it's not like 'React' is the cause of slowness.
  - TekMol 8y ago
    mobile.twitter.com I really don't like it. It's one of these typical slow react experiences where everything I do results in me staring at a loading animation. For example the search experience: I type something and before the typeaheads show up there is a loding bar on top of them. And when I hit enter, I get a loading spinner in the center of the screen. Another example: When I click on a tweet and then click the back button. The page where I came from could be shown instantly. Instead I get some type of fade-in effect on some elements. Etc etc. The whole experience feels terrible clunky on mobile.twitter.com. Compare that to Googles search for example, where everything feels instant. Typeaheads, result pages ... when I click through to a result and hit the back button - I'm instantly at the same result page where I was before.
    - allover 8y ago
      > these typical slow react experiences Again, this is a really bad generalisation you're making. It is ludicrous to attribute the types of slowness you're talking about to React. > Compare that to Googles search for example Do you think it's fair to compare anyone's search to Google's?
    - hungerstrike 8y ago
      Well, sorry but you're wrong about React. You haven't shown any evidence that these things are related to React at all. Here's some counter-evidence though - https://reactjs.org https://reactjs.org - that site is built with React and everything is instant. Also, my own React apps perform instantly and that's because I didn't put in a shitload of JS to do things like track your mouse pointer and do other types of analytics like Twitter probably does.
      - TekMol 8y ago
        reactjs.org When I visit it, the lower half of the screen makes a jump to the left after about 3 seconds. That already makes me feel uneasy. In the 'Tutorial' section, everytime I click on an entry on the right, the screen at first jumps up for a fraction of a second before jumping down again.
        hungerstrike 8y ago
        Sounds like there might be something seriously wrong with your computer, your device, network or your browser then. What’s your set up? I just looked at it on like four different devices and didn’t have any problem. It works perfectly for me on Windows 10 with Chrome, Mac High Sierra/Chrome and iOS 11 / Safari iPad and iPhone. If you don’t believe me, I will post a screen cast on imgur if you’d like.
        TekMol 8y ago
        Yup, screen cast please. You can see the jumping on webpagetest.org: https://www.webpagetest.org/video/compare.php?tests=180616_BQ_41c2864f929eb6fc7c12ce33937dd5fe-r:1-c:0 https://www.webpagetest.org/video/compare.php?tests=180616_B... With a slow connection, on the initial load the first jump happens at 6s and another one at 8.5s. When I click on one of the links, it happens much faster because everything is cached. But I can still see the jump everytime I click a link to a new section in the tutorial. I don't think the type of browser plays a role here. I get the glitches on Chrome and Firefox. And testing it on browserling.com shows that they also happen on Internet Explorer.
madeofpalk 8y ago
The claim that Twitter "Lite" is an improvement is a collective delusion of the web development community, spread by Google and Twitter PWA evangelists. By every measure, except 'shininess', it performs worse that both Twitter.com and the old legacy mobile.twitter.com (which can still be accessed if you set your user agent to something like a Blackberry). Even from a warm cache, Twitter Lite takes longer to display your timeline compared to desktop Twitter. Compared to the legacy mobile twitter site, the PWA version is 15x slower at showing your timeline [1] And this is all the while ignoring the UX annoyances of the PWA version. When loading the timeline, you're presented with about three different loaders, all flashing about the screen. [1]: https://twitter.com/joshhunt/status/980769162770485249 https://twitter.com/joshhunt/status/980769162770485249
- untog 8y ago
  Yep, first load is slower. But loads of any click you make are faster. That's the trade-off.
  - madeofpalk 8y ago
    But first load (and repeat loads of the first page you visit) is the only thing that matters. The primary use case of Twitter is the timeline - if you've made displaying that slower, you failed to make a faster site. You blew it. Of course I know nothing about the complexities of Twitter internally and technically, but I don't understand how they managed to make it slower than the Desktop Twitter, and claim that they built a better experience when they clearly haven't. --- Edit: I just did a tiny bit of by-the-eye comparisons between Desktop Twitter and Twitter Lite, and loading Notifications seems a bit faster on Twitter Lite. Loading Profile might be the tiniest bit faster on Twitter Lite, but I suspect there's a lot of DOM jank that slows displaying the next page. Showing DMs is slower on Twitter Lite compared to Desktop Twitter. But even so, what does this have to do with the PWAs that Google+Twitter evangelise? My understanding is that PWAs are all about speeding up the warm-cache 'first load' [1], and once that's loaded, there's not really much that the PWA technologies will do for you. Both Desktop Twitter and Twitter Lite are Single Page Apps that fetch views from API calls - there's nothing inherently different about Twitter Lite's approach that will make it faster at that compared to Desktop. [1]: 'First load' seems to be the wrong name to call this, but unsure of a better, more concise phrase.
dmitriid 8y ago
Twiiter Lite is an example of a horribly designed website: it's jerky, it has inconsistent behaviour, it has multiple UX issues. It loads reasonably fast, and that's the only thing that's good about it. As a representative of a good React site, it is not.

TekMol 8y ago

Twitter lite: Where is that? AirBnB: I love AirBnBs service, but I totally hate the UI. It's slow and clunky and gets into the way like nothing else. A single page of a room loads over 5MB of data, scrollinig is laggy, everything feels just terrible.

allover 8y ago
> Twitter lite: Where is that? https://mobile.twitter.com https://mobile.twitter.com > AirBnB ... Maybe not the best example. I think they still have a lot of legacy cruft they need to fix. I still think their homepage/search UX is pretty good. And like someone else said, it's not like 'React' is the cause of slowness.
- TekMol 8y ago
  mobile.twitter.com I really don't like it. It's one of these typical slow react experiences where everything I do results in me staring at a loading animation. For example the search experience: I type something and before the typeaheads show up there is a loding bar on top of them. And when I hit enter, I get a loading spinner in the center of the screen. Another example: When I click on a tweet and then click the back button. The page where I came from could be shown instantly. Instead I get some type of fade-in effect on some elements. Etc etc. The whole experience feels terrible clunky on mobile.twitter.com. Compare that to Googles search for example, where everything feels instant. Typeaheads, result pages ... when I click through to a result and hit the back button - I'm instantly at the same result page where I was before.
  - allover 8y ago
    > these typical slow react experiences Again, this is a really bad generalisation you're making. It is ludicrous to attribute the types of slowness you're talking about to React. > Compare that to Googles search for example Do you think it's fair to compare anyone's search to Google's?
  - hungerstrike 8y ago
    Well, sorry but you're wrong about React. You haven't shown any evidence that these things are related to React at all. Here's some counter-evidence though - https://reactjs.org https://reactjs.org - that site is built with React and everything is instant. Also, my own React apps perform instantly and that's because I didn't put in a shitload of JS to do things like track your mouse pointer and do other types of analytics like Twitter probably does.
    - TekMol 8y ago
      reactjs.org When I visit it, the lower half of the screen makes a jump to the left after about 3 seconds. That already makes me feel uneasy. In the 'Tutorial' section, everytime I click on an entry on the right, the screen at first jumps up for a fraction of a second before jumping down again.
      - hungerstrike 8y ago
        Sounds like there might be something seriously wrong with your computer, your device, network or your browser then. What’s your set up? I just looked at it on like four different devices and didn’t have any problem. It works perfectly for me on Windows 10 with Chrome, Mac High Sierra/Chrome and iOS 11 / Safari iPad and iPhone. If you don’t believe me, I will post a screen cast on imgur if you’d like.
        TekMol 8y ago
        Yup, screen cast please. You can see the jumping on webpagetest.org: https://www.webpagetest.org/video/compare.php?tests=180616_BQ_41c2864f929eb6fc7c12ce33937dd5fe-r:1-c:0 https://www.webpagetest.org/video/compare.php?tests=180616_B... With a slow connection, on the initial load the first jump happens at 6s and another one at 8.5s. When I click on one of the links, it happens much faster because everything is cached. But I can still see the jump everytime I click a link to a new section in the tutorial. I don't think the type of browser plays a role here. I get the glitches on Chrome and Firefox. And testing it on browserling.com shows that they also happen on Internet Explorer.

madeofpalk 8y ago

The claim that Twitter "Lite" is an improvement is a collective delusion of the web development community, spread by Google and Twitter PWA evangelists. By every measure, except 'shininess', it performs worse that both Twitter.com and the old legacy mobile.twitter.com (which can still be accessed if you set your user agent to something like a Blackberry). Even from a warm cache, Twitter Lite takes longer to display your timeline compared to desktop Twitter. Compared to the legacy mobile twitter site, the PWA version is 15x slower at showing your timeline [1] And this is all the while ignoring the UX annoyances of the PWA version. When loading the timeline, you're presented with about three different loaders, all flashing about the screen. [1]: https://twitter.com/joshhunt/status/980769162770485249 https://twitter.com/joshhunt/status/980769162770485249

untog 8y ago
Yep, first load is slower. But loads of any click you make are faster. That's the trade-off.
- madeofpalk 8y ago
  But first load (and repeat loads of the first page you visit) is the only thing that matters. The primary use case of Twitter is the timeline - if you've made displaying that slower, you failed to make a faster site. You blew it. Of course I know nothing about the complexities of Twitter internally and technically, but I don't understand how they managed to make it slower than the Desktop Twitter, and claim that they built a better experience when they clearly haven't. --- Edit: I just did a tiny bit of by-the-eye comparisons between Desktop Twitter and Twitter Lite, and loading Notifications seems a bit faster on Twitter Lite. Loading Profile might be the tiniest bit faster on Twitter Lite, but I suspect there's a lot of DOM jank that slows displaying the next page. Showing DMs is slower on Twitter Lite compared to Desktop Twitter. But even so, what does this have to do with the PWAs that Google+Twitter evangelise? My understanding is that PWAs are all about speeding up the warm-cache 'first load' [1], and once that's loaded, there's not really much that the PWA technologies will do for you. Both Desktop Twitter and Twitter Lite are Single Page Apps that fetch views from API calls - there's nothing inherently different about Twitter Lite's approach that will make it faster at that compared to Desktop. [1]: 'First load' seems to be the wrong name to call this, but unsure of a better, more concise phrase.

dmitriid 8y ago

Twiiter Lite is an example of a horribly designed website: it's jerky, it has inconsistent behaviour, it has multiple UX issues. It loads reasonably fast, and that's the only thing that's good about it. As a representative of a good React site, it is not.