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The EU parliament is democratically elected. The EU is not. https://europa.eu/european-union/about-eu/institutions-bodies_en https://europa.eu/european-union/a

by gepi79 8y ago

The EU parliament is democratically elected. The EU is not. https://europa.eu/european-union/about-eu/institutions-bodies_en https://europa.eu/european-union/about-eu/institutions-bodie... One has to wonder if the combination of lack of voting by the people (for whatever reasons) and lack of knowledge of the people should be called a democracy. I am not alone. https://diem25.org/why-europes-treaties-are-failing-its-citizens/ https://diem25.org/why-europes-treaties-are-failing-its-citi...

oldcynic 8y ago
Some parts of the EU are not democratically elected. Neither is the Civil Service in the UK and other nations. Even if the Civil Service or Council of Europe propose legislation it still requires vote by the relevant parliament to be adopted, sometimes the European Council (heads of member states) vote too. You could make the same criticism of any representative democracy: UK, US, all the way down to town council elections. So what now? Referenda for every single proposed law and by-law? Brexit tells me that might not be considered democratic progress. So where does that leave democracy? Non-existent globally? There's a completely different discussion and points on either side about voter engagement and disenfranchisement.
- gepi79 8y ago
  The Civil Services do not propose or enact laws. An EU member state is a representative democracy. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Representative_democracy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Representative_democracy The EU is not. The non-democratic nature goes beyond legislation and affects the economy and poverty and austerity and taxes of members of the Eurozone who have given up their economic and thus political and thus democratic and cultural sovereignty. Granted, the decision to remain in the Eurozone is a national democratic decision. The situation of Greece shows that interests of private companies and states like Germany have priority over the poor members of the Eurozone and EU and IMO over good ethics and the common good. Regarding Italy: http://bilbo.economicoutlook.net/blog/?p=39454 http://bilbo.economicoutlook.net/blog/?p=39454 http://bilbo.economicoutlook.net/blog/?p=39557 http://bilbo.economicoutlook.net/blog/?p=39557 http://bilbo.economicoutlook.net/blog/?p=39549 http://bilbo.economicoutlook.net/blog/?p=39549 It is clear that EU member states are still competing against each other and that the EU is not a common democratic state but an organization where an EU elite and elites of competing members states and lobbyists fight for their ideological and economic and political interests.

by gepi79 8y ago

oldcynic 8y ago

Some parts of the EU are not democratically elected. Neither is the Civil Service in the UK and other nations. Even if the Civil Service or Council of Europe propose legislation it still requires vote by the relevant parliament to be adopted, sometimes the European Council (heads of member states) vote too. You could make the same criticism of any representative democracy: UK, US, all the way down to town council elections. So what now? Referenda for every single proposed law and by-law? Brexit tells me that might not be considered democratic progress. So where does that leave democracy? Non-existent globally? There's a completely different discussion and points on either side about voter engagement and disenfranchisement.

gepi79 8y ago
The Civil Services do not propose or enact laws. An EU member state is a representative democracy. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Representative_democracy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Representative_democracy The EU is not. The non-democratic nature goes beyond legislation and affects the economy and poverty and austerity and taxes of members of the Eurozone who have given up their economic and thus political and thus democratic and cultural sovereignty. Granted, the decision to remain in the Eurozone is a national democratic decision. The situation of Greece shows that interests of private companies and states like Germany have priority over the poor members of the Eurozone and EU and IMO over good ethics and the common good. Regarding Italy: http://bilbo.economicoutlook.net/blog/?p=39454 http://bilbo.economicoutlook.net/blog/?p=39454 http://bilbo.economicoutlook.net/blog/?p=39557 http://bilbo.economicoutlook.net/blog/?p=39557 http://bilbo.economicoutlook.net/blog/?p=39549 http://bilbo.economicoutlook.net/blog/?p=39549 It is clear that EU member states are still competing against each other and that the EU is not a common democratic state but an organization where an EU elite and elites of competing members states and lobbyists fight for their ideological and economic and political interests.