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It's actually established science that your fluid intelligence drops after hitting 30's, and the skills for certain tasks even earlier. It's sad, but it's dumb

It's actually established science that your fluid intelligence drops after hitting 30's, and the skills for certain tasks even earlier. It's sad, but it's dumb to deny biological reality. http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-SBJ2KTl2f3c/VjPN9JeWLiI/AAAAAAAAVdo/fKBVoZw287o/s1600/Age-decline-in-intelligence.jpg http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-SBJ2KTl2f3c/VjPN9JeWLiI/AAAAAAAAVd... https://study.com/cimages/multimages/16/adultintelligence.jpg https://study.com/cimages/multimages/16/adultintelligence.jp... https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-496a52a13eaee1e99f39e3c9e4d5ec73-c https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-496a52a13eaee1e99f39e3...

smrtinsert 8y ago
That's why everyone prefers the 25 year old doctor, said no one ever.
- bufferoverflow 8y ago
  Straw man argument. Being a doctor is not only about fluid intelligence.
  - talmand 8y ago
    I would say any job requires more than just raw intelligence.
  - ageofwant 8y ago
    Being an anything is not only about fluid intelligence. Intelligence, while helpful, is not a good indicator of any metric of success or competence. High childhood intelligence levels are in fact associated with below average adult outcomes - turns out intelligence is paid for with tenacity. Tenacity trumps intelligence as a predictor of adult success.
lovich 8y ago
I don't usually cry for a source in casual conversation, but if you are going to suggest that discriminating against the majority of people,people in their 30s+, then you are going to have to back that up with more than pretty graphs
- bufferoverflow 8y ago
  I said nothing about discriminating against anybody. Please don't make shit up.
  - deleted 8y ago
    [deleted]
  - lovich 8y ago
    >It's actually established science that your fluid intelligence drops after hitting 30's, and the skills for certain tasks even earlier. It's sad, but it's dumb to deny biological reality. Maybe you did not mean it but using the phrase "biological reality" when discussing a demographic of people is a common refrain of people who want to discriminate those groups. If I misread your message, I apologise
    - bufferoverflow 8y ago
      You misread my message. Even if some group of people is objectively dumber, we shouldn't treat them horribly. But it still means that they will likely perform certain tasks worse (and certain other tasks better).
      - deleted 8y ago
        [deleted]
      - wang_li 8y ago
        The issue is whether greater fluid intelligence is better or not for a particular job and whether crystallized intelligence plays any role. Who is better as a linux kernel developer: Linus Torvalds who is 48 but has 28 years of active involvement in the Linux kernel or a 22 year old who has 2 years involvement in writing code for the Linux kernel? Perhaps a 50 year old wouldn't be your first choice for a startup who is looking at a blank slate for their codebase. But there just aren't that many companies who are starting the platform completely from scratch.
0xfeba 8y ago
It's somewhat taboo to mention that though. Reminds me of a Charles Murray's The Bell Curve, which merely pointed out that various races have differing average intelligence. Despite clarifying that the standard deviation was much wider than any of the differences (so you cannot judge an individual based on the results), the author was shamed, blacklisted, and threatened for his work. Some people just like to live in a fairy tale where how everyone should be treated is the same as how everyone actually is.
- ageofwant 8y ago
  The reason for age discrimination is almost never capability. The majority of older engineers, especially in more established professions like Civil, Mechanical and Electronic Engineering are obviously and demonstrably better engineers than younger ones. This comes from simple experience and time spent on a subject. In less established professions where techniques and processes are more in flux, not enough time is spent on any topic to produce true masters - in software, there are only apprentices and journeymen. Principal level Civil Engineers can expect to make about 120% more than juniors - so firing one principal saves a lot of money on the books this quarter. These companies wither and die as they bleed away core competencies and corporate memory.
- s2g 8y ago
  Has anyone ever referenced that work and not been a complete racist piece of crap?
  - SamReidHughes 8y ago
    Charles Murray?
hfdgiutdryg 8y ago
I'll take wisdom and experience over dubious claims of "fluid intelligence" for most roles.
mistrial9 8y ago
your magic fluid intelligence does not account for many, many aspects of systems.. not the least of which is, where does this lead?
ageofwant 8y ago
Biological reality is that under 30's need every iota of evolutionary advantage they can get to at least try and compete against the experience and survival skills of The Vetted. This and the sometimes unfortunate tendency of not eating our young is all that gives <30 younglings an inkling of a chance.

smrtinsert 8y ago

That's why everyone prefers the 25 year old doctor, said no one ever.

bufferoverflow 8y ago
Straw man argument. Being a doctor is not only about fluid intelligence.
- talmand 8y ago
  I would say any job requires more than just raw intelligence.
- ageofwant 8y ago
  Being an anything is not only about fluid intelligence. Intelligence, while helpful, is not a good indicator of any metric of success or competence. High childhood intelligence levels are in fact associated with below average adult outcomes - turns out intelligence is paid for with tenacity. Tenacity trumps intelligence as a predictor of adult success.

lovich 8y ago

I don't usually cry for a source in casual conversation, but if you are going to suggest that discriminating against the majority of people,people in their 30s+, then you are going to have to back that up with more than pretty graphs

bufferoverflow 8y ago
I said nothing about discriminating against anybody. Please don't make shit up.
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
- lovich 8y ago
  >It's actually established science that your fluid intelligence drops after hitting 30's, and the skills for certain tasks even earlier. It's sad, but it's dumb to deny biological reality. Maybe you did not mean it but using the phrase "biological reality" when discussing a demographic of people is a common refrain of people who want to discriminate those groups. If I misread your message, I apologise
  - bufferoverflow 8y ago
    You misread my message. Even if some group of people is objectively dumber, we shouldn't treat them horribly. But it still means that they will likely perform certain tasks worse (and certain other tasks better).
    - deleted 8y ago
      [deleted]
    - wang_li 8y ago
      The issue is whether greater fluid intelligence is better or not for a particular job and whether crystallized intelligence plays any role. Who is better as a linux kernel developer: Linus Torvalds who is 48 but has 28 years of active involvement in the Linux kernel or a 22 year old who has 2 years involvement in writing code for the Linux kernel? Perhaps a 50 year old wouldn't be your first choice for a startup who is looking at a blank slate for their codebase. But there just aren't that many companies who are starting the platform completely from scratch.

0xfeba 8y ago

It's somewhat taboo to mention that though. Reminds me of a Charles Murray's The Bell Curve, which merely pointed out that various races have differing average intelligence. Despite clarifying that the standard deviation was much wider than any of the differences (so you cannot judge an individual based on the results), the author was shamed, blacklisted, and threatened for his work. Some people just like to live in a fairy tale where how everyone should be treated is the same as how everyone actually is.

ageofwant 8y ago
The reason for age discrimination is almost never capability. The majority of older engineers, especially in more established professions like Civil, Mechanical and Electronic Engineering are obviously and demonstrably better engineers than younger ones. This comes from simple experience and time spent on a subject. In less established professions where techniques and processes are more in flux, not enough time is spent on any topic to produce true masters - in software, there are only apprentices and journeymen. Principal level Civil Engineers can expect to make about 120% more than juniors - so firing one principal saves a lot of money on the books this quarter. These companies wither and die as they bleed away core competencies and corporate memory.
s2g 8y ago
Has anyone ever referenced that work and not been a complete racist piece of crap?
- SamReidHughes 8y ago
  Charles Murray?

hfdgiutdryg 8y ago

I'll take wisdom and experience over dubious claims of "fluid intelligence" for most roles.

mistrial9 8y ago

your magic fluid intelligence does not account for many, many aspects of systems.. not the least of which is, where does this lead?

ageofwant 8y ago

Biological reality is that under 30's need every iota of evolutionary advantage they can get to at least try and compete against the experience and survival skills of The Vetted. This and the sometimes unfortunate tendency of not eating our young is all that gives <30 younglings an inkling of a chance.