3 ms·

I don't think it's the State's job to shun individuals for poor social behavior. If school administrators do not have the authority to kick bullies out of schoo

by rhema 8y ago

I don't think it's the State's job to shun individuals for poor social behavior. If school administrators do not have the authority to kick bullies out of school based on poor patterns of behavior, do they really need to escalate to criminal offenses that put them in prison? Maybe we should keep shunning criteria off the books when possible and let society establish its norms like actual human beings.

jessedhillon 8y ago
Citation needed for the idea that there was a golden age wherein healthy norms were formed and communicated, without at least the implication of backing by an authoritative enforcer. In what I know about such golden age references, one or more was true: - deviants operated unacknowledged in shadows, - society operated under the idea that there was an acceptable class of victims, - an in group either openly or tacitly wielded the authority of the state So I don't find the "why not let people solve their own problems at a societal scale" as being a particularly well-informed critique.
- rhema 8y ago
  >Citation needed for the idea that there was a golden age I didn't mean to imply this. There never was and will never be a golden age of people interacting, whether state or socially mandated. I do think that person-to-person and community-to-community scales better than state-sized laws in terms of choosing who gets rewarded and punished. The problem is that laws are hard to write that capture emerging social norms. The "no child left behind" act may have kept too many people in school (bullies that these new laws are targeting). Giving teachers authority to throw out trouble-makers seems like a better solution (for all parties) than outright criminalizing deviant behavior.
mc32 8y ago
I almost wonder if they will be issuing ASBOs ala UK... sigh...
- DanBC 8y ago
  You know the UK no longer has ASBOs, right?

by rhema 8y ago

jessedhillon 8y ago

Citation needed for the idea that there was a golden age wherein healthy norms were formed and communicated, without at least the implication of backing by an authoritative enforcer. In what I know about such golden age references, one or more was true: - deviants operated unacknowledged in shadows, - society operated under the idea that there was an acceptable class of victims, - an in group either openly or tacitly wielded the authority of the state So I don't find the "why not let people solve their own problems at a societal scale" as being a particularly well-informed critique.

rhema 8y ago
>Citation needed for the idea that there was a golden age I didn't mean to imply this. There never was and will never be a golden age of people interacting, whether state or socially mandated. I do think that person-to-person and community-to-community scales better than state-sized laws in terms of choosing who gets rewarded and punished. The problem is that laws are hard to write that capture emerging social norms. The "no child left behind" act may have kept too many people in school (bullies that these new laws are targeting). Giving teachers authority to throw out trouble-makers seems like a better solution (for all parties) than outright criminalizing deviant behavior.

mc32 8y ago

I almost wonder if they will be issuing ASBOs ala UK... sigh...

DanBC 8y ago
You know the UK no longer has ASBOs, right?