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Do not bet against Tesla unless you are a professional. Tesla has incredible PR and Finance departments with background proponents holding enough capital to hel

Do not bet against Tesla unless you are a professional. Tesla has incredible PR and Finance departments with background proponents holding enough capital to help them through rough patches. Side note, their Q2 2013 is still one of my favorite Finance/PR plays in recent memory.

confiscate 8y ago
what happened in Q2 2013? sorry I did not follow news about Tesla until later
- stevievee 8y ago
  They used stock issuance to repay their government loan and the only headlines the public saw was "Tesla repays government loan early!" leaving stock price a net gain after the issuance
  - hinkley 8y ago
    There was a time when half of Microsoft's net profits came from stock dilution. They were issuing new shares for employee stock option grants, so the strike price went into revenue every time options were exercised. The schadenfreude crowd was waiting and hoping for MS to make a big misstep. Any slip in profit would reduce their P/E, and if the stock price leveled off they would get hit again when option exercises declined, taking them negative (fewer new employees also equals less stock revenue). As one person put it, they were a bicycle. Stable while moving but would fall over as soon as they stopped. But I got bored of following MS long before those supposed hens came home to roost so I have no clue what really happened.
    - slededit 8y ago
      The price leveled out, the last few years of employee options expired out of the money. New employees got stock grants instead and the stock was stagnant in a narrow range for a decade.
freerobby 8y ago
Agree with the conclusion, disagree with the reasoning. In the end, good products and strategies win. Betting against Tesla is dumb because they've proven the doubters wrong about their products and strategies over and over again. They've stayed right on course with the ten-year plan they laid out ten years ago, and every product they've built has been loved by an overwhelming majority of its owners. Not many companies can say that, not even successful ones. Short sellers need to tip their caps and recognize that Tesla understands what it's doing better than they do. The longer it takes them to realize this, the more money they're going to lose.
- stevievee 8y ago
  They have yet to prove any of the doubters wrong with regard to the model 3, sorry. Also, the stock is not traded on fundamentals as much as you or the rest of the public believes.
  - freerobby 8y ago
    > They have yet to prove any of the doubters wrong with regard to the model 3, sorry. There will always be an unproven next step. The point is that in each example where we have a clear conclusion, the conclusion has been favorable for Tesla. My money is on the Model 3 continuing this trend. > Also, the stock is not traded on fundamentals as much as you or the rest of the public believes. I never said (nor do I think) that the stock is traded on fundamentals.
    - stevievee 8y ago
      > There will always be an unproven next step. This makes no sense in a trading environment. The reason that shortsellers are hovering is because Tesla is trading at aggressive multiples with aggressive business goals they show signs of missing. I'd like to see your "clear conclusions" that the model 3 is succeeding. > I never said (nor do I think) that the stock is traded on fundamentals. Semantics at this point.

confiscate 8y ago

what happened in Q2 2013? sorry I did not follow news about Tesla until later

stevievee 8y ago
They used stock issuance to repay their government loan and the only headlines the public saw was "Tesla repays government loan early!" leaving stock price a net gain after the issuance
- hinkley 8y ago
  There was a time when half of Microsoft's net profits came from stock dilution. They were issuing new shares for employee stock option grants, so the strike price went into revenue every time options were exercised. The schadenfreude crowd was waiting and hoping for MS to make a big misstep. Any slip in profit would reduce their P/E, and if the stock price leveled off they would get hit again when option exercises declined, taking them negative (fewer new employees also equals less stock revenue). As one person put it, they were a bicycle. Stable while moving but would fall over as soon as they stopped. But I got bored of following MS long before those supposed hens came home to roost so I have no clue what really happened.
  - slededit 8y ago
    The price leveled out, the last few years of employee options expired out of the money. New employees got stock grants instead and the stock was stagnant in a narrow range for a decade.

freerobby 8y ago

Agree with the conclusion, disagree with the reasoning. In the end, good products and strategies win. Betting against Tesla is dumb because they've proven the doubters wrong about their products and strategies over and over again. They've stayed right on course with the ten-year plan they laid out ten years ago, and every product they've built has been loved by an overwhelming majority of its owners. Not many companies can say that, not even successful ones. Short sellers need to tip their caps and recognize that Tesla understands what it's doing better than they do. The longer it takes them to realize this, the more money they're going to lose.

stevievee 8y ago
They have yet to prove any of the doubters wrong with regard to the model 3, sorry. Also, the stock is not traded on fundamentals as much as you or the rest of the public believes.
- freerobby 8y ago
  > They have yet to prove any of the doubters wrong with regard to the model 3, sorry. There will always be an unproven next step. The point is that in each example where we have a clear conclusion, the conclusion has been favorable for Tesla. My money is on the Model 3 continuing this trend. > Also, the stock is not traded on fundamentals as much as you or the rest of the public believes. I never said (nor do I think) that the stock is traded on fundamentals.
  - stevievee 8y ago
    > There will always be an unproven next step. This makes no sense in a trading environment. The reason that shortsellers are hovering is because Tesla is trading at aggressive multiples with aggressive business goals they show signs of missing. I'd like to see your "clear conclusions" that the model 3 is succeeding. > I never said (nor do I think) that the stock is traded on fundamentals. Semantics at this point.