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I think this is an interesting and unintended consequence of AirBnB not investing nearly on filtering their users. AirBnB obviously was interested in getting t

by Fede_V 8y ago

I think this is an interesting and unintended consequence of AirBnB not investing nearly on filtering their users. AirBnB obviously was interested in getting their product used by as many people as people (growth at all costs) - but this had the effect of getting a lot of young, cost conscious people to take holidays in area that were traditionally residential. While most AirBnB renters are polite and respectful, enough of them were loud, disruptive and ignoring the local rules (for example, tourists in Venice who use AirBnB but ignore the very strict garbage disposal laws) that local residents started dreading having AirBnBs around. AirBnB is already very strict with landlords: it needs to start being a lot stricter with its users too. They rapidly need to educate their users about how to be good citizens, and that the motto of 'the customer is always right' is completely the wrong way to think about a stay in a residential area in a foreign city. Users should think of themselves as a respectful guest, not an entitled customer.

StavrosK 8y ago
No, sorry. AirBnB is creating immense problems in tourist destinations, to the point where people in major cities in Greece (and other countries) are having trouble finding affordable permanent housing. Barcelona and Rome are overrun with tourists, and it's killing the cities. AirBnB should just go away, the market worked very well before it, even if things were a bit more expensive.
- ng12 8y ago
  > the market worked very well before it I don't think AirBnB was the cause of the Greek debt crisis.
- piyh 8y ago
  Let's go back to taxis while we're at it.
  - StavrosK 8y ago
    Taxis are a problem, but Uber is not the solution.
    - xapata 8y ago
      Oh? What is? Uber/Lyft seem like a great solution to me.
      - danudey 8y ago
        Uber is a great concept, but the reality is that Uber has shown us time and time again why taxis cost what they do: regulation to protect users and our cities. Uber, like AirBnB and a lot of other startups, are 'disrupting' industries by entering them and taking them over by ignoring regulations, insurance, and even laws to keep costs low and make a profit. In this day and age, they can grow fast enough that by the time cities see the repercussions and react to them, the companies are big enough and rich enough (and flush enough with VC money) to fight back, and are already entrenched with a loud and enthusiastic user base. In other words, Uber is great if you ignore the various safety and insurance regulations, background checks, licensing, etc. that taxis have to comply with.
        xapata 8y ago
        Uber provides commercial insurance, no? Other than that, I generally feel safer in an Uber ride than in a taxi.
        xapata 8y ago
        To explain: I've never been yelled at by an Uber driver. I have been cursed at by taxi drivers. Yes, more than one. They often don't like my destination and get mad at me for being in their cab. "I've been waiting for two hours, and you're going to Chinatown!? Fuck you!" (Not far enough) "Brooklyn?! Fuck you!" (Wants to stay in Manhattan) One cabbie was so pissed he went 70 in a 35 zone to demonstrate how annoying my destination was. Cabbies pretend to get lost so that the fare is longer. Uber will refund the difference. Etc. Etc.
- soperj 8y ago
  Depends on who you are. It worked terribly for people with young families or families that were over 4 people.
  - StavrosK 8y ago
    Why? Can those families find housing more easily?
    - xevb3k 8y ago
      Hotels suck for families is what the comment is trying to say I think. With young kids, you often what your own cooking/food preparation facilities. Sleep arrangements are often easier in a house too. Ironically, it seems like hotels with food preparation areas are more common in Japan (weekly mansion/business type hotels).
      - StavrosK 8y ago
        Yes, but I'm saying "AirBnB sucks for people living in the city" and you're saying "it's great for if you want to travel there".
        soperj 8y ago
        > the market worked very well before it That's specifically what I was replying to. I live(and rent) in a city that is tourist based and less affordable because of airb&b and the like. It has a vacancy rate of under 1%. So i completely understand what you're saying. I just disagree that the market for staying somewhere worked well before airb&b.
        StavrosK 8y ago
        Oh, I see. Maybe, I don't really have experience with traveling with a family.
        8y ago
- Fede_V 8y ago
  I can't wrap my mind around people that think that 'too many tourists' or 'too many jobs' are a problem. Those are 'problems' that most cities in the world would kill for: if we consider them problems it's because we are not nearly creative enough to take advantage of them. As a simple example: if we have too many tourists, give a progressive daily tax that's charged to every visitor that automatically includes museum visits/etc. Use that revenue to build more housing for local residents (and if some dipshit points out that more housing ruins a neighboorhood's character, ask yourself if Paris or suburbia has more character) or to subsidize local transport infrastructure.
  - Sangermaine 8y ago
    >I can't wrap my mind around people that think that 'too many tourists' or 'too many jobs' are a problem. Step outside of theoretical economic thought experiments and try living in a formerly quiet neighborhood or building suddenly experiencing an influx of loud drunk littering assholes. Residential areas are desired as residential areas for a reason. I live in NYC and sure as hell don't want to live around Times Square. There are actual people living in these cities who want a decent quality of life where they live. Echoing many others in the this thread, in a previous apartment in a residential area of Manhattan someone down the hall starting renting their unit to Airbnb visitors. It was a nightmare, but thankfully the landlord caught wind in a few weeks and kicked the person out.
    - xapata 8y ago
      The correct way to handle those problems is to enforce noise and litter regulations. If your owner-neighbor is rowdy, it's no different than if their guests are rowdy.
      - Xylakant 8y ago
        Neighbor stays and is subject to enforcement, AirBnB guest leaves and isn’t.
        8y ago
- robertAngst 8y ago
  This sounds like those cities do not have an educated/skilled workforce. Sure there are spots near the Roman forum you would expect to have lots of tourists(basically inside the Aurellian walls). But outside of that its a 20+ minute drive for a tourist to popular areas. If a 50$ airbnb is beating out a $1,000/mo rent its because people cannot afford $1000 in rent. We host an airbnb ourselves, lots of business travelers in our area. If people are coming to visit what humans did 2000 years ago and not visiting the humans there today, I dont think the problem is Airbnb.
  - StavrosK 8y ago
    I'm not sure I understand what you mean, but nobody is going to be able to afford to pay hotel rates for their permanent residence.
    - xapata 8y ago
      Depends on the kind of hotel. And after the market settles, hotel rates may not be as high. A key aspect of hotel rates is that they fluctuate with demand. When you come into town for the big event, the rates may be 4 times higher than staying on a cold, boring night. A long-term stay will be much cheaper per-night than a nightly rate.
      - jessaustin 8y ago
        In my part of midwest USA, multiple giant hotels seem to be nearing completion: EIFS is nearly complete, windows have been in a couple of months, concrete parking lot is poured, etc. Apparently investors are expecting a lot more travelers to this thoroughly ordinary area.
    - robertAngst 8y ago
      Airbnbs are not passive income. You need to take down sheets, wash them, remake the bed, clean the bathroom, buy fruit/food every ~3 days, vacuum, be available for your guests. When you have tenets, its passive income. You clean up every 6 months to 3+ years. Airbnb pays better, but its labor. The ~300$/mo difference can easily be accounted for with that. Not to mention the cost of food(always HQ), electricity, water, heat/AC. The items I listed are not optional, people can give you a bad review regardless what expectations you set with prices + description.
- Thriptic 8y ago
  I can't speak to this problem in tourist destinations or Europe generally as I don't have enough data to have an opinion, but I frequently see Airbnb blamed for high housing costs in some American cities and it strikes me as being a bunch of bullshit. Sure Airbnb doesn't help the rental problem and it is a contributor to rising rents, but the primary problem isn't Airbnb, it's lack of supply of high density apartment living options. Many US cities are composed primarily of 2-3 story houses which have been converted into dingy expensive apartments. This is utterly unacceptable from an efficiency standpoint. Many of these units need to be bulldozed and replaced with high rise apartments if cities are to become affordable again.
  - jaytong 8y ago
    and to top it all off, the zoning laws in some cities...
  - StavrosK 8y ago
    The situation in Greece is very different, as everything is a highrise (sadly, because we tore down a lot of beautiful centuries-old antique villas to do that). The situation used to be much better, but the start of the problem coincides suspiciously with the rise of AirBnB, and you'd expect housing prices to drop in a recession, not rise. That's why I think it's fair to blame AirBnB for that. We'll see what happens in Tokyo, Madrid and other cities where they're severely restricting usage.
    - distances 8y ago
      But apartments in Athens are very affordable still, aren't they?
      - ferongr 8y ago
        Yes, as well as rents. A 1BR apartment can be as low as 150€/mo or even a bit lower. It's only a few "hip" neighborhoods that are affected. Still, Athens is relatively compact and mass transit is excellent so you can easily find cheap places to live that are require less than 30 minutes of commute each way to work.
- eanzenberg 8y ago
  >> the market worked very well before it You mean during the recession?
  - StavrosK 8y ago
    That would imply things got better in some way, which they haven't. We're still in a recession and deteriorating.
wyck 8y ago
Not true in Canada, AirBnB breaks municipal and in some cases provincial laws for short term rentals. Thousands of houses are in no rent zones and AirBnB knows damn well. The tactic to combat these rentals is to use provincial & city inspectors who levy huge taxes and prohibit short-term rentals with the landlords, but they are very understaffed and generally ineffective. AirbNB is getting away with very grey legal area here, they should he held legally accountable for facilitating illegal rentals. Right now my tax dollars are paying for the government to enforce what AirBnB sells without impunity. On a personal note I'm thinking of pursuing this legally with AirBnB and/or my city, my street has 4 illegal AirBnB rentals on it and my city can't see to enforce their own laws. There's enough interest in my region to easily get about 30 people on board, and that's just one semi small town. And we don't blame the users of AirBnB, they dont know the local laws, we blame the landlords and ultimately the platform. I know in west coast tourism destinations you will practically get beat up if your renting out to airBnB illegally since it has such a negative effect on local housing prices.
- robertAngst 8y ago
  I wonder what the environment would be if there wasnt so many laws ontop of laws.
lechiffre10 8y ago
"AirBnB is already very strict with landlords: it needs to start being a lot stricter with its users too." It's not as strict with landlords as it should be. And while it is strict with users it actually favors landlords and by a landslide. Have you ever rented long term with AirBnB? Hosts can literally cancel the reservation for any reason( Airbnb says they punish for doing so but rarely if ever because the Host can provide any reason) If you happen to be in a city that doesn't have as many Airbnbs and you get a really good deal, you're screwed if the host decides to cancel. Costs for Airbnb's have also gone up significantly that it's often not even worth it to rent one if you happen to be less than a group of 4 people.
- pmiller2 8y ago
  The last few times I was tempted to use Airbnb for stays of around a week, I found the price to be comparable to hotels in the area. I ended up getting a hotel, because I wanted my stay to be managed by professionals.
  - nngrey 8y ago
    I'm also doubtful about the management of hosts. Yesterday, an Airbnb Superhost cancelled my upcoming reservation without explanation. I booked with a hotel and saved about $25. Airbnb has been my first choice for awhile. I think it is going to be my back up choice for the near future.
    - kevining 8y ago
      I had the same issue. An Airbnb host cancelled our reservation the day before our booking was supposed to start and Airbnb didn't help us out at all. We ended up paying quite a bit more for a hotel, but after going through that I'm happy to pay more in the future for professionalism and a guaranteed bed.
    - larntz 8y ago
      Last weekend I attempted to use airbnb in Orlando. Originally the host said the door would be unlocked, but when we arrived it was locked. It was a keypad lock so we wrote the host and asked for the code. He wrote back and sent a code that didn't work. When we informed him the code didn't work his response was, really? We never heard from him again that night or since asking for a refund. We stayed in a hotel nearby that cost about $30 more, but had free breakfast. I will go for hotels first in the future. I never had any issues with airbnb in the past, but one night of waiting around to hear from the host (and never actually gaining entry) with a family of tired people is one too many.
sreyaNotfilc 8y ago
Well, you've already answered my question before I made a random response. I was going to ask "Why are there laws against people making money?", but it make sense. Residential areas are for residents, not commerce. There should be a place for folks to relax around their contemporaries without having to deal with knowing that their environment may change from day to day. I would say, perhaps there should be a compromise. After-all, being able to rent out a room from time to time can help home owners stay in their homes longer (or even enjoy life more). Maybe there could be a 2-3 strike rule on tenants. Where, if things do go out of hand (for whatever that reason), then the homeowner cannot be part of the AirBnb renting experience. That way, there is something to gain and something to loose. Educating tenants would be priority.
- cwkoss 8y ago
  I think part of the issue is that AirBnb is probably not very good at catching a banned user making a new account. I don't think they ask for users' IDs. Presumably anyone could sign up with a fake name and a prepaid credit card, act wild, get banned, and repeat the process. Determining the identity of an online user can be pretty hard. AirBnB doesn't want to add verification steps that will cause attrition in the rental pipeline, so they'd rather do nothing than do a little and be seen as failing at it.
  - padthai 8y ago
    I had to upload a a national id or passport when I registered.
    - cwkoss 8y ago
      Ah, they must have added this since I used them. Probably a smart move on their part.
JohnTHaller 8y ago
"AirBnB is already very strict with landlords" Does AirBnB ensure that the landlord/owner is properly licensed to offer the property for a short term rental before listing it? Or do they just take the landlord's word for it? "While most AirBnB renters are polite and respectful, enough of them were loud, disruptive and ignoring the local rules (for example, tourists in Venice who use AirBnB but ignore the very strict garbage disposal laws) that local residents started dreading having AirBnBs around." A short term renter in an unlicensed business operating next door to you in your residential apartment building is necessarily going to be louder, less safe, and cause more issues than a long term neighbor. I rent a residential apartment in a residential building on a residential street. I did not rent a hotel room for a year next to other hotel rooms.
- lebanon_tn 8y ago
  Pardon my ignorance. What is the benefit / purpose of the license besides added revenue for whatever municipality the rental is in? Is there some kind of inspection or background check process?
  - tptacek 8y ago
    One obvious benefit is that the owner or lessor of the place being sublet on Airbnb is often a party to contracts with their community that forbid short-term rentals; for instance, the owners of condominiums have a responsibility shared with all the other owners of condominiums not to compromise everyone's quiet enjoyment expectations by turning their place into a hostel.
  - newfoundglory 8y ago
    Is this a serious question? It allows an area to be in control of how many short term rentals are being made, and where they are, and how often they are available.
shados 8y ago
Airbnb wouldn't want to do this though. A lot of cities are made almost entirely of condos and apartments that specifically rule out short term rentals (and have had since before Airbnb was even a thing). If people respected laws, rules, etc, they'd have nearly no product in the hottest areas. Airbnb as you know it would be a mere shadow of what it is now.
debt 8y ago
AirBnB also immediately contributed to a very serious housing shortage and has contributed to rising rents everywhere. The effects are just now being understood which why legislation is just now being enacted to taper it a bit.
rsynnott 8y ago
> AirBnB is already very strict with landlords It's not at all strict with landlords. Requiring hotel/b&b zoning would be being strict with landlords, say, and that's what many countries and municipalities now do, but AirBnB seems to generally have little interest in helping to enforce that.
- Gustomaximus 8y ago
  I had a host saep apartment on me to a smaller one. Then the new on clearly didn't have sheets changed or bathrooms cleaned. I flagged this to Airbnb and nothing. Very surprised as this was a bit of a shock how bad it could be. Since then I prefer hotels. The cost difference isn't that much and it's simpler to deal with occasional errors like this.
nkkollaw 8y ago
I agree with your point. I'd however like to add to this: "Users should think of themselves as a respectful guest, not an entitled customer". Lots of landlords that rent places for a living started using AirBnB. I specially experienced this in Poland, where I often had to go to a company-owned building to pick up the keys. There they had an office, reception, etc. It didn't feel any different from a hotel. One time we complained about an apartment, and they gave us another one that was empty. So, my point is that the host often sets the mood. If it's a hotel-like structure that even has self check-in, with a company that uses its own website, Booking, AirBnb and whatever else is around to rent rooms, you feel like an entitled customer. If an old woman opens the door to the guest house, you feel like a guest in her house. I guess AirBnB departed from their original vision of having people sleep in your living room on an air mattress, and it's now used by hospitality companies as another channel to get customers. When that is the case, you definitely feel like acting as a guest at a hotel, since that's what it is although booked via AirBnB.
csomar 8y ago
It is funny but you know there is an invention to the problem you just mentioned: It is called a "Hotel". For cost conscious people it is called a "Hostel" or a "Guest House". The reason Airbnb is cheaper is because users are running afoul of the laws and possibly taxes. Have you checked the Airbnb listings? Very little people are sharing their places. Most of the people are running this as a business. Many of them are not either there and delegate the key to another third-party. It is a mess. And I'm not against it (I'm not a legal citizen of every country). But it is not fair to have registered hotel who comply with rules and pay taxes. And have Airbnb. You'll have to pick.

by Fede_V 8y ago

StavrosK 8y ago

No, sorry. AirBnB is creating immense problems in tourist destinations, to the point where people in major cities in Greece (and other countries) are having trouble finding affordable permanent housing. Barcelona and Rome are overrun with tourists, and it's killing the cities. AirBnB should just go away, the market worked very well before it, even if things were a bit more expensive.

ng12 8y ago
> the market worked very well before it I don't think AirBnB was the cause of the Greek debt crisis.
piyh 8y ago
Let's go back to taxis while we're at it.
- StavrosK 8y ago
  Taxis are a problem, but Uber is not the solution.
  - xapata 8y ago
    Oh? What is? Uber/Lyft seem like a great solution to me.
    - danudey 8y ago
      Uber is a great concept, but the reality is that Uber has shown us time and time again why taxis cost what they do: regulation to protect users and our cities. Uber, like AirBnB and a lot of other startups, are 'disrupting' industries by entering them and taking them over by ignoring regulations, insurance, and even laws to keep costs low and make a profit. In this day and age, they can grow fast enough that by the time cities see the repercussions and react to them, the companies are big enough and rich enough (and flush enough with VC money) to fight back, and are already entrenched with a loud and enthusiastic user base. In other words, Uber is great if you ignore the various safety and insurance regulations, background checks, licensing, etc. that taxis have to comply with.
      - xapata 8y ago
        Uber provides commercial insurance, no? Other than that, I generally feel safer in an Uber ride than in a taxi.
        xapata 8y ago
        To explain: I've never been yelled at by an Uber driver. I have been cursed at by taxi drivers. Yes, more than one. They often don't like my destination and get mad at me for being in their cab. "I've been waiting for two hours, and you're going to Chinatown!? Fuck you!" (Not far enough) "Brooklyn?! Fuck you!" (Wants to stay in Manhattan) One cabbie was so pissed he went 70 in a 35 zone to demonstrate how annoying my destination was. Cabbies pretend to get lost so that the fare is longer. Uber will refund the difference. Etc. Etc.
soperj 8y ago
Depends on who you are. It worked terribly for people with young families or families that were over 4 people.
- StavrosK 8y ago
  Why? Can those families find housing more easily?
  - xevb3k 8y ago
    Hotels suck for families is what the comment is trying to say I think. With young kids, you often what your own cooking/food preparation facilities. Sleep arrangements are often easier in a house too. Ironically, it seems like hotels with food preparation areas are more common in Japan (weekly mansion/business type hotels).
    - StavrosK 8y ago
      Yes, but I'm saying "AirBnB sucks for people living in the city" and you're saying "it's great for if you want to travel there".
      - soperj 8y ago
        > the market worked very well before it That's specifically what I was replying to. I live(and rent) in a city that is tourist based and less affordable because of airb&b and the like. It has a vacancy rate of under 1%. So i completely understand what you're saying. I just disagree that the market for staying somewhere worked well before airb&b.
        StavrosK 8y ago
        Oh, I see. Maybe, I don't really have experience with traveling with a family.
        8y ago
Fede_V 8y ago
I can't wrap my mind around people that think that 'too many tourists' or 'too many jobs' are a problem. Those are 'problems' that most cities in the world would kill for: if we consider them problems it's because we are not nearly creative enough to take advantage of them. As a simple example: if we have too many tourists, give a progressive daily tax that's charged to every visitor that automatically includes museum visits/etc. Use that revenue to build more housing for local residents (and if some dipshit points out that more housing ruins a neighboorhood's character, ask yourself if Paris or suburbia has more character) or to subsidize local transport infrastructure.
- Sangermaine 8y ago
  >I can't wrap my mind around people that think that 'too many tourists' or 'too many jobs' are a problem. Step outside of theoretical economic thought experiments and try living in a formerly quiet neighborhood or building suddenly experiencing an influx of loud drunk littering assholes. Residential areas are desired as residential areas for a reason. I live in NYC and sure as hell don't want to live around Times Square. There are actual people living in these cities who want a decent quality of life where they live. Echoing many others in the this thread, in a previous apartment in a residential area of Manhattan someone down the hall starting renting their unit to Airbnb visitors. It was a nightmare, but thankfully the landlord caught wind in a few weeks and kicked the person out.
  - xapata 8y ago
    The correct way to handle those problems is to enforce noise and litter regulations. If your owner-neighbor is rowdy, it's no different than if their guests are rowdy.
    - Xylakant 8y ago
      Neighbor stays and is subject to enforcement, AirBnB guest leaves and isn’t.
      - 8y ago
robertAngst 8y ago
This sounds like those cities do not have an educated/skilled workforce. Sure there are spots near the Roman forum you would expect to have lots of tourists(basically inside the Aurellian walls). But outside of that its a 20+ minute drive for a tourist to popular areas. If a 50$ airbnb is beating out a $1,000/mo rent its because people cannot afford $1000 in rent. We host an airbnb ourselves, lots of business travelers in our area. If people are coming to visit what humans did 2000 years ago and not visiting the humans there today, I dont think the problem is Airbnb.
- StavrosK 8y ago
  I'm not sure I understand what you mean, but nobody is going to be able to afford to pay hotel rates for their permanent residence.
  - xapata 8y ago
    Depends on the kind of hotel. And after the market settles, hotel rates may not be as high. A key aspect of hotel rates is that they fluctuate with demand. When you come into town for the big event, the rates may be 4 times higher than staying on a cold, boring night. A long-term stay will be much cheaper per-night than a nightly rate.
    - jessaustin 8y ago
      In my part of midwest USA, multiple giant hotels seem to be nearing completion: EIFS is nearly complete, windows have been in a couple of months, concrete parking lot is poured, etc. Apparently investors are expecting a lot more travelers to this thoroughly ordinary area.
  - robertAngst 8y ago
    Airbnbs are not passive income. You need to take down sheets, wash them, remake the bed, clean the bathroom, buy fruit/food every ~3 days, vacuum, be available for your guests. When you have tenets, its passive income. You clean up every 6 months to 3+ years. Airbnb pays better, but its labor. The ~300$/mo difference can easily be accounted for with that. Not to mention the cost of food(always HQ), electricity, water, heat/AC. The items I listed are not optional, people can give you a bad review regardless what expectations you set with prices + description.
Thriptic 8y ago
I can't speak to this problem in tourist destinations or Europe generally as I don't have enough data to have an opinion, but I frequently see Airbnb blamed for high housing costs in some American cities and it strikes me as being a bunch of bullshit. Sure Airbnb doesn't help the rental problem and it is a contributor to rising rents, but the primary problem isn't Airbnb, it's lack of supply of high density apartment living options. Many US cities are composed primarily of 2-3 story houses which have been converted into dingy expensive apartments. This is utterly unacceptable from an efficiency standpoint. Many of these units need to be bulldozed and replaced with high rise apartments if cities are to become affordable again.
- jaytong 8y ago
  and to top it all off, the zoning laws in some cities...
- StavrosK 8y ago
  The situation in Greece is very different, as everything is a highrise (sadly, because we tore down a lot of beautiful centuries-old antique villas to do that). The situation used to be much better, but the start of the problem coincides suspiciously with the rise of AirBnB, and you'd expect housing prices to drop in a recession, not rise. That's why I think it's fair to blame AirBnB for that. We'll see what happens in Tokyo, Madrid and other cities where they're severely restricting usage.
  - distances 8y ago
    But apartments in Athens are very affordable still, aren't they?
    - ferongr 8y ago
      Yes, as well as rents. A 1BR apartment can be as low as 150€/mo or even a bit lower. It's only a few "hip" neighborhoods that are affected. Still, Athens is relatively compact and mass transit is excellent so you can easily find cheap places to live that are require less than 30 minutes of commute each way to work.
eanzenberg 8y ago
>> the market worked very well before it You mean during the recession?
- StavrosK 8y ago
  That would imply things got better in some way, which they haven't. We're still in a recession and deteriorating.

wyck 8y ago

Not true in Canada, AirBnB breaks municipal and in some cases provincial laws for short term rentals. Thousands of houses are in no rent zones and AirBnB knows damn well. The tactic to combat these rentals is to use provincial & city inspectors who levy huge taxes and prohibit short-term rentals with the landlords, but they are very understaffed and generally ineffective. AirbNB is getting away with very grey legal area here, they should he held legally accountable for facilitating illegal rentals. Right now my tax dollars are paying for the government to enforce what AirBnB sells without impunity. On a personal note I'm thinking of pursuing this legally with AirBnB and/or my city, my street has 4 illegal AirBnB rentals on it and my city can't see to enforce their own laws. There's enough interest in my region to easily get about 30 people on board, and that's just one semi small town. And we don't blame the users of AirBnB, they dont know the local laws, we blame the landlords and ultimately the platform. I know in west coast tourism destinations you will practically get beat up if your renting out to airBnB illegally since it has such a negative effect on local housing prices.

robertAngst 8y ago
I wonder what the environment would be if there wasnt so many laws ontop of laws.

lechiffre10 8y ago

"AirBnB is already very strict with landlords: it needs to start being a lot stricter with its users too." It's not as strict with landlords as it should be. And while it is strict with users it actually favors landlords and by a landslide. Have you ever rented long term with AirBnB? Hosts can literally cancel the reservation for any reason( Airbnb says they punish for doing so but rarely if ever because the Host can provide any reason) If you happen to be in a city that doesn't have as many Airbnbs and you get a really good deal, you're screwed if the host decides to cancel. Costs for Airbnb's have also gone up significantly that it's often not even worth it to rent one if you happen to be less than a group of 4 people.

pmiller2 8y ago
The last few times I was tempted to use Airbnb for stays of around a week, I found the price to be comparable to hotels in the area. I ended up getting a hotel, because I wanted my stay to be managed by professionals.
- nngrey 8y ago
  I'm also doubtful about the management of hosts. Yesterday, an Airbnb Superhost cancelled my upcoming reservation without explanation. I booked with a hotel and saved about $25. Airbnb has been my first choice for awhile. I think it is going to be my back up choice for the near future.
  - kevining 8y ago
    I had the same issue. An Airbnb host cancelled our reservation the day before our booking was supposed to start and Airbnb didn't help us out at all. We ended up paying quite a bit more for a hotel, but after going through that I'm happy to pay more in the future for professionalism and a guaranteed bed.
  - larntz 8y ago
    Last weekend I attempted to use airbnb in Orlando. Originally the host said the door would be unlocked, but when we arrived it was locked. It was a keypad lock so we wrote the host and asked for the code. He wrote back and sent a code that didn't work. When we informed him the code didn't work his response was, really? We never heard from him again that night or since asking for a refund. We stayed in a hotel nearby that cost about $30 more, but had free breakfast. I will go for hotels first in the future. I never had any issues with airbnb in the past, but one night of waiting around to hear from the host (and never actually gaining entry) with a family of tired people is one too many.

sreyaNotfilc 8y ago

Well, you've already answered my question before I made a random response. I was going to ask "Why are there laws against people making money?", but it make sense. Residential areas are for residents, not commerce. There should be a place for folks to relax around their contemporaries without having to deal with knowing that their environment may change from day to day. I would say, perhaps there should be a compromise. After-all, being able to rent out a room from time to time can help home owners stay in their homes longer (or even enjoy life more). Maybe there could be a 2-3 strike rule on tenants. Where, if things do go out of hand (for whatever that reason), then the homeowner cannot be part of the AirBnb renting experience. That way, there is something to gain and something to loose. Educating tenants would be priority.

cwkoss 8y ago
I think part of the issue is that AirBnb is probably not very good at catching a banned user making a new account. I don't think they ask for users' IDs. Presumably anyone could sign up with a fake name and a prepaid credit card, act wild, get banned, and repeat the process. Determining the identity of an online user can be pretty hard. AirBnB doesn't want to add verification steps that will cause attrition in the rental pipeline, so they'd rather do nothing than do a little and be seen as failing at it.
- padthai 8y ago
  I had to upload a a national id or passport when I registered.
  - cwkoss 8y ago
    Ah, they must have added this since I used them. Probably a smart move on their part.

JohnTHaller 8y ago

"AirBnB is already very strict with landlords" Does AirBnB ensure that the landlord/owner is properly licensed to offer the property for a short term rental before listing it? Or do they just take the landlord's word for it? "While most AirBnB renters are polite and respectful, enough of them were loud, disruptive and ignoring the local rules (for example, tourists in Venice who use AirBnB but ignore the very strict garbage disposal laws) that local residents started dreading having AirBnBs around." A short term renter in an unlicensed business operating next door to you in your residential apartment building is necessarily going to be louder, less safe, and cause more issues than a long term neighbor. I rent a residential apartment in a residential building on a residential street. I did not rent a hotel room for a year next to other hotel rooms.

lebanon_tn 8y ago
Pardon my ignorance. What is the benefit / purpose of the license besides added revenue for whatever municipality the rental is in? Is there some kind of inspection or background check process?
- tptacek 8y ago
  One obvious benefit is that the owner or lessor of the place being sublet on Airbnb is often a party to contracts with their community that forbid short-term rentals; for instance, the owners of condominiums have a responsibility shared with all the other owners of condominiums not to compromise everyone's quiet enjoyment expectations by turning their place into a hostel.
- newfoundglory 8y ago
  Is this a serious question? It allows an area to be in control of how many short term rentals are being made, and where they are, and how often they are available.

shados 8y ago

Airbnb wouldn't want to do this though. A lot of cities are made almost entirely of condos and apartments that specifically rule out short term rentals (and have had since before Airbnb was even a thing). If people respected laws, rules, etc, they'd have nearly no product in the hottest areas. Airbnb as you know it would be a mere shadow of what it is now.

debt 8y ago

AirBnB also immediately contributed to a very serious housing shortage and has contributed to rising rents everywhere. The effects are just now being understood which why legislation is just now being enacted to taper it a bit.

rsynnott 8y ago

> AirBnB is already very strict with landlords It's not at all strict with landlords. Requiring hotel/b&b zoning would be being strict with landlords, say, and that's what many countries and municipalities now do, but AirBnB seems to generally have little interest in helping to enforce that.

Gustomaximus 8y ago
I had a host saep apartment on me to a smaller one. Then the new on clearly didn't have sheets changed or bathrooms cleaned. I flagged this to Airbnb and nothing. Very surprised as this was a bit of a shock how bad it could be. Since then I prefer hotels. The cost difference isn't that much and it's simpler to deal with occasional errors like this.

nkkollaw 8y ago

I agree with your point. I'd however like to add to this: "Users should think of themselves as a respectful guest, not an entitled customer". Lots of landlords that rent places for a living started using AirBnB. I specially experienced this in Poland, where I often had to go to a company-owned building to pick up the keys. There they had an office, reception, etc. It didn't feel any different from a hotel. One time we complained about an apartment, and they gave us another one that was empty. So, my point is that the host often sets the mood. If it's a hotel-like structure that even has self check-in, with a company that uses its own website, Booking, AirBnb and whatever else is around to rent rooms, you feel like an entitled customer. If an old woman opens the door to the guest house, you feel like a guest in her house. I guess AirBnB departed from their original vision of having people sleep in your living room on an air mattress, and it's now used by hospitality companies as another channel to get customers. When that is the case, you definitely feel like acting as a guest at a hotel, since that's what it is although booked via AirBnB.

csomar 8y ago

It is funny but you know there is an invention to the problem you just mentioned: It is called a "Hotel". For cost conscious people it is called a "Hostel" or a "Guest House". The reason Airbnb is cheaper is because users are running afoul of the laws and possibly taxes. Have you checked the Airbnb listings? Very little people are sharing their places. Most of the people are running this as a business. Many of them are not either there and delegate the key to another third-party. It is a mess. And I'm not against it (I'm not a legal citizen of every country). But it is not fair to have registered hotel who comply with rules and pay taxes. And have Airbnb. You'll have to pick.