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I am a licensed electrician in a few states. When the whole 2008 economy collapse thing happened a lot of us tradies went to work for Home Depot. The pay was sh

I am a licensed electrician in a few states. When the whole 2008 economy collapse thing happened a lot of us tradies went to work for Home Depot. The pay was shit but it payed the rent and helped with food. There are actually a fair amount of skilled people working there.. Even today. But if you ask where you can find a light switch they will point you in the right direction. They won't dig deeper unless you ask. Here is what terrified me. I started around four years after youtube. Now everyone was a electrician because wanglover76 posted a video of how to install a ceiling fan and tie it into a dimmer. It is pretty hard to convince a person shopping at home depot that their weekend project will probably kill their children.

blackbrokkoli 8y ago
Honest question: How to decide wether or not you can do something yourself? Like, it's technically required to get an electrican to change a light bulb - but who does this? So what is ok? Where is the line between setting up a desk lamp and stealing electricity from your neighbour with a screwdriver?
- varjag 8y ago
  Here (Norway) it's whenever it involves the work on the mains panel or on unterminated power wire. You can change ceiling fixture if it has a clip in power socket, you can of course change lightbulbs (doubt it's licensed anywhere in the world), you can even install electric flooring that clicks to connect. You can't do anything that requires tying or soldering power wire together, and you can't install hidden cabling/channels and fixtures yourself (fire safety reasons).
  - lotsofpulp 8y ago
    Does that include running Ethernet or HDMI and other low power cables?
    - varjag 8y ago
      You can put exterior signal cables yourself. The wall conducts for such cables still have to be put in place by electricians I believe, but not 100% sure.
      - yason 8y ago
        Most likely you can freely do the installation yourself but it has to be connected or maybe just cross-checked and then signed off by a certified electrician to become a legal installation. That's what homeowners commonly do to save money.
        walshemj 8y ago
        Even for cat5/6 installs ?
        pdpi 8y ago
        That cat5 cable seems like a safe enough thing but it’ll wreck your day if it shorts something else carrying more juice.
      - zip1234 8y ago
        You don't need wall conduits for low voltage cables. The 'boxes' for them are just meant to hold a cover in front.
  - amalag 8y ago
    So can you change an electric outlet? That means turning off the individual circuit (or mains if you are paranoid) then opening, disconnecting, connecting a new one. What about installing a ceiling fan? Assuming the wiring is already there.
    - varjag 8y ago
      No you can't change an outlet yourself, legally. And ceiling fans are really uncommon in Norway. But am sure plenty of people do small fixes anyway.
  - 0xfeba 8y ago
    I find that hard to believe. In the US you can't market yourself as an electrician/handyman unless you are licensed. But you can fix you or your neighbors outlets all you want. The distinction is drawn at being a business vs yourself. But, we still have that individualist spirit, so I could be wrong about other places.
    - varjag 8y ago
      People do that anyway, just that you'll have tough luck if it comes up in an insurance case. Or worse if you are in a condo and other people suffer. Wiring and outlets are simple enough, but you wouldn't believe peoples' capacity to botch things up. They'd connect a ground pin socket in place of non grounded one without changing the wiring, or use incorrect section wire, or with incorrect insulation type for in-wall application, or they'd replace a charred outlet without trimming the sooted part of wire. Enough nuances to avoid amateur work.
    - acranox 8y ago
      In some cities you would need a permit to replace an outlet. And only licensed electricians are allowed to get permits. In some cities bad wiring jobs don’t just burn you own house down, it’ll take the neighbors house with it. So it’s not just your butt on the line if you screw up.
- jules 8y ago
  Modern safety features shut it down if current goes into the earth, so the most dangerous is if you touch both wires and are well isolated from the earth. This makes you look like a light bulb to the safety features. The other danger is that it sets your house on fire a week after you've "fixed" something. That said, as a kid I played with 230v electrolysis (stupid I know) because my 30v version was too slow. This is basically the worst case scenario: electrodes close to each other + water + combustible gas + potential for sparks + deadly voltage, but the safety system shut the power down immediately when something went wrong.
  - colanderman 8y ago
    > Modern safety features shut it down if current goes into the earth What? No, that's only true for GFCI circuits, which are not the norm in the US (typically only found in bathrooms and kitchens, though the NEC has been slowly expanding the requirements). Touching hot can kill you and the breaker box won't care. Actual safety advice: 1. Buy a current sensor. They're like $5 from Home Depot (speaking of). 2. Turn off the breaker, and make sure it's the right one by using the current sensor. 3. If you're in a situation where you cannot turn off the breaker, wear rubber-soled shoes, and work with one hand and place the other behind your back. (This prevents current from traversing your chest cavity.) 4. Buy a receptacle tester (again, $5) and use it to test your work. 5. If any of the above is not obvious to you, hire an electrician.
    - toasterlovin 8y ago
      And, like red, green refactor, make sure the current sensor correctly detects current before you turn off the breaker. Then make sure it detects no current after you turn off the breaker.
    - jules 8y ago
      Oh, where I live they were made mandatory something like 50 years ago so I assumed they were standard in every developed country because they cost $30 a piece so why not? Much better life extension value for money than a medical checkup. I wouldn't want to live in a house where every appliance is a potential death trap. They might even pay for themselves purely in cash if they save you an appliance. Mine activated just last week when someone dropped water over the power extender contact and still proceeded to turn it on.
- bluGill 8y ago
  I get a permit for my work, and the inspector comes to verify that I do it right. I sometimes make small mistakes, but the inspector gets me to correct them before something goes wrong. I have also read several books; watched several videos; and watched other people do this work. Over time I've picked up a number of things, and the different sources helps ensure I can pick up on what is correct vs what looks like it works but is wrong.
- colanderman 8y ago
  Experience. Start with the simplest of things: replacing a standard (non-GFCI) receptacle. Buy a book that tells you how, or learn from someone who knows. (Both is best.) Don't guess at anything. If the book doesn't say exactly what to do in the situation you're in, hire an electrician. (This sounds overly cautious but really – if you're doing something even slightly "novel" then there's either going to be code issues you aren't qualified to judge, or actual electrical issues you aren't familiar with and don't even know to think about, like grounding issues.) Thankfully, most situations a homeowner will encounter aren't left up to interpretation by code, and are therefore covered in a good book. Move on to similar things (say, replacing a simple switch or GFCI receptacle) when you feel you have enough experience.
  - pitaj 8y ago
    When I was young (< 14yo) I bought a book at Lowe's called "The Complete Guide to Home Wiring". Of course, this was abnormal but I had an extreme curiosity about electricity. (I still do which is why I'm an EE now)
- deleted 8y ago
  [deleted]
shaftway 8y ago
I've had such terrible advice that I've quit going to Home Depot altogether; I spend the extra 3 minutes to drive to Lowe's. And it's from the exact opposite of what you describe. I needed to run a bit of low-voltage wiring from the house to a sprinkler controller. I knew to use the dark grey PVC-like conduit (is it actually PVC? I have no idea). I had everything I needed except the glue. I've seen electricians run the same stuff and I knew the glue they use was clear, not blue like it is for water pipes, but I couldn't find that glue near the conduit. I asked the guy in the electrical department with a thing on his apron with "ask me about electrical stuff" written on it. He spent the next 5 minutes trying to talk me out of using the correct glue, and instead he told me to go get some 2-part epoxy and use that. The kind of epoxy that expands, and would crack the rigid pipe, and has zero guarantee of standing up to water. In the rare cases I do have to go to Home Depot I either ignore anything anyone there tells me, or I tell them I rent (because that way they won't try to sell me solar).
- sokoloff 8y ago
  > dark grey PVC-like conduit (is it actually PVC? I have no idea) It is. > I've seen electricians run the same stuff and I knew the glue they use was clear The solvent ("glue") is more typically grey than clear IME for PVC electrical conduit. For PVC electrical conduit, it's a one-step process (no primer needed). For PVC water or DWV pipe, it's a two-step (primer and solvent-glue) process; it's the primer that is typically colored and the solvent typically clear. The color in the primer is to facilitate inspection afterwards and the pipes are typically hidden. Electrical conduit is often visible where installed, and there's less tolerance to have the staining from the primer step used in water piping.
  - bluGill 8y ago
    You can get clear primer for water PVC. If the inspector trusts you he will let you use it. However if the inspector has any doubts about your abilities he will demand you use the purple stuff (including rip out all your work that is probably perfectly good just so e can see you used the primer). The purple is just a dye, it serves no purpose other than to inform the inspector that you used it. The reason you don't need primer on electrical is the connection is only required to be mechanically strong - water leaks are just fine. If there is any possibility of water getting into pipe you are required to use wires that have a waterproof insulation.
icebraining 8y ago
Has there been an epidemic of dead children since YouTube came around?

blackbrokkoli 8y ago

Honest question: How to decide wether or not you can do something yourself? Like, it's technically required to get an electrican to change a light bulb - but who does this? So what is ok? Where is the line between setting up a desk lamp and stealing electricity from your neighbour with a screwdriver?

varjag 8y ago
Here (Norway) it's whenever it involves the work on the mains panel or on unterminated power wire. You can change ceiling fixture if it has a clip in power socket, you can of course change lightbulbs (doubt it's licensed anywhere in the world), you can even install electric flooring that clicks to connect. You can't do anything that requires tying or soldering power wire together, and you can't install hidden cabling/channels and fixtures yourself (fire safety reasons).
- lotsofpulp 8y ago
  Does that include running Ethernet or HDMI and other low power cables?
  - varjag 8y ago
    You can put exterior signal cables yourself. The wall conducts for such cables still have to be put in place by electricians I believe, but not 100% sure.
    - yason 8y ago
      Most likely you can freely do the installation yourself but it has to be connected or maybe just cross-checked and then signed off by a certified electrician to become a legal installation. That's what homeowners commonly do to save money.
      - walshemj 8y ago
        Even for cat5/6 installs ?
        pdpi 8y ago
        That cat5 cable seems like a safe enough thing but it’ll wreck your day if it shorts something else carrying more juice.
    - zip1234 8y ago
      You don't need wall conduits for low voltage cables. The 'boxes' for them are just meant to hold a cover in front.
- amalag 8y ago
  So can you change an electric outlet? That means turning off the individual circuit (or mains if you are paranoid) then opening, disconnecting, connecting a new one. What about installing a ceiling fan? Assuming the wiring is already there.
  - varjag 8y ago
    No you can't change an outlet yourself, legally. And ceiling fans are really uncommon in Norway. But am sure plenty of people do small fixes anyway.
- 0xfeba 8y ago
  I find that hard to believe. In the US you can't market yourself as an electrician/handyman unless you are licensed. But you can fix you or your neighbors outlets all you want. The distinction is drawn at being a business vs yourself. But, we still have that individualist spirit, so I could be wrong about other places.
  - varjag 8y ago
    People do that anyway, just that you'll have tough luck if it comes up in an insurance case. Or worse if you are in a condo and other people suffer. Wiring and outlets are simple enough, but you wouldn't believe peoples' capacity to botch things up. They'd connect a ground pin socket in place of non grounded one without changing the wiring, or use incorrect section wire, or with incorrect insulation type for in-wall application, or they'd replace a charred outlet without trimming the sooted part of wire. Enough nuances to avoid amateur work.
  - acranox 8y ago
    In some cities you would need a permit to replace an outlet. And only licensed electricians are allowed to get permits. In some cities bad wiring jobs don’t just burn you own house down, it’ll take the neighbors house with it. So it’s not just your butt on the line if you screw up.
jules 8y ago
Modern safety features shut it down if current goes into the earth, so the most dangerous is if you touch both wires and are well isolated from the earth. This makes you look like a light bulb to the safety features. The other danger is that it sets your house on fire a week after you've "fixed" something. That said, as a kid I played with 230v electrolysis (stupid I know) because my 30v version was too slow. This is basically the worst case scenario: electrodes close to each other + water + combustible gas + potential for sparks + deadly voltage, but the safety system shut the power down immediately when something went wrong.
- colanderman 8y ago
  > Modern safety features shut it down if current goes into the earth What? No, that's only true for GFCI circuits, which are not the norm in the US (typically only found in bathrooms and kitchens, though the NEC has been slowly expanding the requirements). Touching hot can kill you and the breaker box won't care. Actual safety advice: 1. Buy a current sensor. They're like $5 from Home Depot (speaking of). 2. Turn off the breaker, and make sure it's the right one by using the current sensor. 3. If you're in a situation where you cannot turn off the breaker, wear rubber-soled shoes, and work with one hand and place the other behind your back. (This prevents current from traversing your chest cavity.) 4. Buy a receptacle tester (again, $5) and use it to test your work. 5. If any of the above is not obvious to you, hire an electrician.
  - toasterlovin 8y ago
    And, like red, green refactor, make sure the current sensor correctly detects current before you turn off the breaker. Then make sure it detects no current after you turn off the breaker.
  - jules 8y ago
    Oh, where I live they were made mandatory something like 50 years ago so I assumed they were standard in every developed country because they cost $30 a piece so why not? Much better life extension value for money than a medical checkup. I wouldn't want to live in a house where every appliance is a potential death trap. They might even pay for themselves purely in cash if they save you an appliance. Mine activated just last week when someone dropped water over the power extender contact and still proceeded to turn it on.
bluGill 8y ago
I get a permit for my work, and the inspector comes to verify that I do it right. I sometimes make small mistakes, but the inspector gets me to correct them before something goes wrong. I have also read several books; watched several videos; and watched other people do this work. Over time I've picked up a number of things, and the different sources helps ensure I can pick up on what is correct vs what looks like it works but is wrong.
colanderman 8y ago
Experience. Start with the simplest of things: replacing a standard (non-GFCI) receptacle. Buy a book that tells you how, or learn from someone who knows. (Both is best.) Don't guess at anything. If the book doesn't say exactly what to do in the situation you're in, hire an electrician. (This sounds overly cautious but really – if you're doing something even slightly "novel" then there's either going to be code issues you aren't qualified to judge, or actual electrical issues you aren't familiar with and don't even know to think about, like grounding issues.) Thankfully, most situations a homeowner will encounter aren't left up to interpretation by code, and are therefore covered in a good book. Move on to similar things (say, replacing a simple switch or GFCI receptacle) when you feel you have enough experience.
- pitaj 8y ago
  When I was young (< 14yo) I bought a book at Lowe's called "The Complete Guide to Home Wiring". Of course, this was abnormal but I had an extreme curiosity about electricity. (I still do which is why I'm an EE now)
deleted 8y ago
[deleted]

shaftway 8y ago

I've had such terrible advice that I've quit going to Home Depot altogether; I spend the extra 3 minutes to drive to Lowe's. And it's from the exact opposite of what you describe. I needed to run a bit of low-voltage wiring from the house to a sprinkler controller. I knew to use the dark grey PVC-like conduit (is it actually PVC? I have no idea). I had everything I needed except the glue. I've seen electricians run the same stuff and I knew the glue they use was clear, not blue like it is for water pipes, but I couldn't find that glue near the conduit. I asked the guy in the electrical department with a thing on his apron with "ask me about electrical stuff" written on it. He spent the next 5 minutes trying to talk me out of using the correct glue, and instead he told me to go get some 2-part epoxy and use that. The kind of epoxy that expands, and would crack the rigid pipe, and has zero guarantee of standing up to water. In the rare cases I do have to go to Home Depot I either ignore anything anyone there tells me, or I tell them I rent (because that way they won't try to sell me solar).

sokoloff 8y ago
> dark grey PVC-like conduit (is it actually PVC? I have no idea) It is. > I've seen electricians run the same stuff and I knew the glue they use was clear The solvent ("glue") is more typically grey than clear IME for PVC electrical conduit. For PVC electrical conduit, it's a one-step process (no primer needed). For PVC water or DWV pipe, it's a two-step (primer and solvent-glue) process; it's the primer that is typically colored and the solvent typically clear. The color in the primer is to facilitate inspection afterwards and the pipes are typically hidden. Electrical conduit is often visible where installed, and there's less tolerance to have the staining from the primer step used in water piping.
- bluGill 8y ago
  You can get clear primer for water PVC. If the inspector trusts you he will let you use it. However if the inspector has any doubts about your abilities he will demand you use the purple stuff (including rip out all your work that is probably perfectly good just so e can see you used the primer). The purple is just a dye, it serves no purpose other than to inform the inspector that you used it. The reason you don't need primer on electrical is the connection is only required to be mechanically strong - water leaks are just fine. If there is any possibility of water getting into pipe you are required to use wires that have a waterproof insulation.

icebraining 8y ago

Has there been an epidemic of dead children since YouTube came around?