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Why is Mozilla investing in this study? It’s a good cause but should Mozilla be the one doing this? I feel bad when they are doing this but I still can’t use Fi

Why is Mozilla investing in this study? It’s a good cause but should Mozilla be the one doing this? I feel bad when they are doing this but I still can’t use Firefox on macOS because they won’t implement support for keychain and then they go ahead and stretch themselves thin on these things. I mean it’s all good and fine but please also focus on the one thing you are supposed to be doing primarily. Disclaimer: I donate to Firefox.

minitel 8y ago
As much as I love firefox, I'm sad to say that the executives who run Mozilla Corp are of a self-serving variety. Not in terms of material greed so much as in terms of craving social status. It's apparent in their meetings if you watch and listen. What I mean to say is, the people in charge of the purse strings are chasing after ego boosting "social good" type stuff over improving the tech and improving the internet. Stuff that will grab a few headlines and make them feel warm and fuzzy when they tell people about "their" company at dinner parties. The rank and file employees are some of the most awesome people on the planet though.
maxerickson 8y ago
This is a rounding error in their budget. They have $500 million in revenues. https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/foundation/annualreport/2016/ https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/foundation/annualreport/2016/
- eklavya 8y ago
  What would be the excuse to flat out ignore all those desperate user requests then? Issue list: https://github.com/jfitzell/mozilla-keychain/issues/88#issuecomment-332331685 https://github.com/jfitzell/mozilla-keychain/issues/88#issue...
  - Spivak 8y ago
    "Why is an organization spending their money on things that I personally don't care about? Large groups of people can only do ever one thing at a time and problems can always be solved faster by throwing money at them."
    - eklavya 8y ago
      Are you making this statement after looking at the issues I linked?
  - staticassertion 8y ago
    Nice - can't have a Mozilla related article without someone posting their pet bug.
    - eklavya 8y ago
      Why not? Do you feel what I wrote was unrelated, off topic, not important?
      - staticassertion 8y ago
        Yeah, it was a really low content post, for sure. It didn't have much to do with the article at all - or even the same organization, technically. And in every topic like this, ones about Mozilla's spending (or sometimes Chrome or any other org that has a popular, free product), someone feels the need to say "but why not this one bug that I harp on?" really, really consistently.
        eklavya 8y ago
        Treating users this way "harping about a bug" is a surefire way to lose market share. I wonder if this is really the case. I didn't know about the organisational structure. For a lot of people Mozilla IS Firefox. How was it low content? In a post about spending am I not allowed to specify my opinion about the spending? You can think of me as some entitled jerk and that's your opinion and I myself doubt I might be acting like one. "But" I would expect that you would allow me to at least say how I feel about it. It's not a technical debate, there can be multiple points of view not necessarily right or wrong.
  - awalton 8y ago
    Whataboutmeism in Open Source is just as toxic as Whataboutism is to Politics.
CorpusCalcium 8y ago
>Disclaimer: I donate to Firefox. No, you really don't. You donate to the Mozilla Foundation, who are the non-profit parent company who do these kinds of things, not build Firefox. Firefox is made by their subsidiary Corporation, who cannot accept your donations. The Corporation doesn't even need your donations anyway; they make a lot more revenue than the donations Mozilla receives. However, the more you donate, the larger the whole company is allowed to grow while legally being a non-profit. Also, the more is donated, the more they are allowed to transfer between the Foundation and the Corporation. But you are still not ultimately donating to Firefox. You are donating to the Foundation, who need the money more in the first place so that the whole can legally remain a non-profit, even if they earn more revenue. Whether or not you feel they should have more money to work with is up to you, but I note that quite a few people seem to wish that Mozilla could do pie-in-the-sky stuff like manage their own user clouds and VPNs and search engines while not remaining motivated by shareholder profits.
- eklavya 8y ago
  Well, the email that asked me to donate very much implied that I should donate to keep Firefox going and fight the good fight. I might have misunderstood it and since my money is not needed, I should consider donating to something else in the future.
  - CorpusCalcium 8y ago
    Feel free, but I don't see why you would draw the conclusion that your money is not needed from what I said (even if Firefox has enough revenue to work with for now, your donations keep the whole organization viable as-is; you're just not directly donating to Firefox).

minitel 8y ago

As much as I love firefox, I'm sad to say that the executives who run Mozilla Corp are of a self-serving variety. Not in terms of material greed so much as in terms of craving social status. It's apparent in their meetings if you watch and listen. What I mean to say is, the people in charge of the purse strings are chasing after ego boosting "social good" type stuff over improving the tech and improving the internet. Stuff that will grab a few headlines and make them feel warm and fuzzy when they tell people about "their" company at dinner parties. The rank and file employees are some of the most awesome people on the planet though.

maxerickson 8y ago

This is a rounding error in their budget. They have $500 million in revenues. https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/foundation/annualreport/2016/ https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/foundation/annualreport/2016/

eklavya 8y ago
What would be the excuse to flat out ignore all those desperate user requests then? Issue list: https://github.com/jfitzell/mozilla-keychain/issues/88#issuecomment-332331685 https://github.com/jfitzell/mozilla-keychain/issues/88#issue...
- Spivak 8y ago
  "Why is an organization spending their money on things that I personally don't care about? Large groups of people can only do ever one thing at a time and problems can always be solved faster by throwing money at them."
  - eklavya 8y ago
    Are you making this statement after looking at the issues I linked?
- staticassertion 8y ago
  Nice - can't have a Mozilla related article without someone posting their pet bug.
  - eklavya 8y ago
    Why not? Do you feel what I wrote was unrelated, off topic, not important?
    - staticassertion 8y ago
      Yeah, it was a really low content post, for sure. It didn't have much to do with the article at all - or even the same organization, technically. And in every topic like this, ones about Mozilla's spending (or sometimes Chrome or any other org that has a popular, free product), someone feels the need to say "but why not this one bug that I harp on?" really, really consistently.
      - eklavya 8y ago
        Treating users this way "harping about a bug" is a surefire way to lose market share. I wonder if this is really the case. I didn't know about the organisational structure. For a lot of people Mozilla IS Firefox. How was it low content? In a post about spending am I not allowed to specify my opinion about the spending? You can think of me as some entitled jerk and that's your opinion and I myself doubt I might be acting like one. "But" I would expect that you would allow me to at least say how I feel about it. It's not a technical debate, there can be multiple points of view not necessarily right or wrong.
- awalton 8y ago
  Whataboutmeism in Open Source is just as toxic as Whataboutism is to Politics.

CorpusCalcium 8y ago

>Disclaimer: I donate to Firefox. No, you really don't. You donate to the Mozilla Foundation, who are the non-profit parent company who do these kinds of things, not build Firefox. Firefox is made by their subsidiary Corporation, who cannot accept your donations. The Corporation doesn't even need your donations anyway; they make a lot more revenue than the donations Mozilla receives. However, the more you donate, the larger the whole company is allowed to grow while legally being a non-profit. Also, the more is donated, the more they are allowed to transfer between the Foundation and the Corporation. But you are still not ultimately donating to Firefox. You are donating to the Foundation, who need the money more in the first place so that the whole can legally remain a non-profit, even if they earn more revenue. Whether or not you feel they should have more money to work with is up to you, but I note that quite a few people seem to wish that Mozilla could do pie-in-the-sky stuff like manage their own user clouds and VPNs and search engines while not remaining motivated by shareholder profits.

eklavya 8y ago
Well, the email that asked me to donate very much implied that I should donate to keep Firefox going and fight the good fight. I might have misunderstood it and since my money is not needed, I should consider donating to something else in the future.
- CorpusCalcium 8y ago
  Feel free, but I don't see why you would draw the conclusion that your money is not needed from what I said (even if Firefox has enough revenue to work with for now, your donations keep the whole organization viable as-is; you're just not directly donating to Firefox).