13 ms·

> You pay $0.20 per hour for the EKS Control Plane, and usual EC2, EBS, and Load Balancing prices for resources that run in your account Objectively that's not

by yebyen 8y ago

> You pay $0.20 per hour for the EKS Control Plane, and usual EC2, EBS, and Load Balancing prices for resources that run in your account Objectively that's not bad for HA masters in separate AZs, but I think for those who have been using Kubernetes on the Google cloud it's certainly going to have a hard time competing with "you don't pay anything for HA masters at all." > ingress from the Twitch stream, it sounds like they have not worked out ingress with ALBs. No mention of Ingress on the announcement page. Twitch stream is here[1]. (it's over now) [2] This is going to be super expensive to use in the near term. Just now Nishi Davidson has just mentioned ingress/ALB is a focus of the sig-aws, so hopefully we can expect another announcement soon. [1]: https://www.twitch.tv/aws https://www.twitch.tv/aws [2]: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/269722012 https://www.twitch.tv/videos/269722012

allanbreyes 8y ago
HA seems like a poor choice as a default. I don't want to pay ~$150/month for dev and staging clusters, and I certainly don't need them to be HA. IIUC, Google/GKE and Microsoft/AKS are single-zone by default... free for masters, but not free for HA.
- user5994461 8y ago
  Google and Amazon are enterprise services. If you consider $150 too expensive, you are not part of the target customers.
  - yebyen 8y ago
    The Google GKE offering can operate with a single g1-small worker. That's $0.0257/hr or $0.0070/hr preemptible. $5/mo minimum* This is not even the same ballpark. *(to be fair, the $5/mo minimum does not include a private network and a load balancer, and you will almost definitely need both in order to actually do anything with a cluster.)
    - nat 8y ago
      You're thinking like a human. There are plenty of organizations where $5/mo and $150/mo are essentially indistinguishable and would not affect decision making in any way.
      - yebyen 8y ago
        That's $150/mo before you even launch a single worker tho. I don't know about you, but I'd personally rather pay the $5 if I don't need a serious cluster yet. How much in actual absolute dollars do you think this is going to cost you, just in order to figure out exactly how it works, and what other AWS widgets you'll also need to pay for in order to use it effectively? I am a human, basically looking for a stepping stone on some actual cloud to land on that is comparable to Minikube, and this sure isn't it.
        deleted 8y ago
        [deleted]
        yebyen 8y ago
        I'm pretty clearly in the minority with my opinion here, and I recognize that. Amazon has made a substantial investment in Kubernetes here and that is nothing to shrug at. They are entitled (and justified) to recoup it. It's fair to say that K8S is not for lightweights, too. AWS provides a fairly generous free tier and they are also justified to extract some payment from every user of their services that derives some non-negligible value. If you're using Kubernetes and you're not getting any value out of it, I think it's also fair to say that you're doing it wrong.
        user5994461 8y ago
        You're not in the minority. It's well understood that there are amateurs trying to use the expensive clouds and shave off every penny, while the main customers are enterprise customers who couldn't notice a thousand dollars more or less. It's just pointless for small users to argue about AWS costs. The service is not meant for them and it cannot fulfill their requirements.
- thesandlord 8y ago
  GKE is free for HA as well: https://cloudplatform.googleblog.com/2018/06/Regional-clusters-in-Google-Kubernetes-Engine-are-now-generally-available.html https://cloudplatform.googleblog.com/2018/06/Regional-cluste...
- exelius 8y ago
  Looks like they want companies to pay to avoid the platform lock-in that k8s helps you avoid...
- idunno246 8y ago
  Until recently gke was charging 0.15/ hour too, so aws is just a little behind https://cloudplatform.googleblog.com/2017/11/Cutting-Cluster-Management-Fees-on-Google-Kubernetes-Engine.html?m=1 https://cloudplatform.googleblog.com/2017/11/Cutting-Cluster...
  - yebyen 8y ago
    Not only recently, but actually this was the cost until yesterday for GKE with HA masters distributed across AZs[1]! I only heard that this announcement from AWS was likely coming this morning, over here in the thread about upgrading GKE clusters[2]. Given how long we've waited since the announcement at November's re:Invent, there's honestly not a lot that seems terribly rushed about this news, but I bet that AWS really would have liked to have Ingress controllers that are integrated with ALB ready for this announcement to go with their CNI plugins. "Why am I waiting for Amazon to get out of preview when Google's been giving it away this whole time?" For AWS customers that aren't locked in, that seems like a reasonable train of thought. [1]: https://cloudplatform.googleblog.com/2018/06/Regional-clusters-in-Google-Kubernetes-Engine-are-now-generally-available.html https://cloudplatform.googleblog.com/2018/06/Regional-cluste... [2]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17236794 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17236794
stingraycharles 8y ago
I look at this more as a product catering to existing AWS customers (and not have them move to GC) rather than trying to lure GC customers over to AWS.
Rapzid 8y ago
Ouch, no option to schedule pods onto the control plane for small clusters?
- thesandlord 8y ago
  AFAIK, none of the big three cloud providers (GKE,AKS,EKS) lets you do this.
  - yebyen 8y ago
    Yeah, none of the rest of the big three are asking you to pay anything for those masters at this point, though. "They're your nodes, you paid for them" seems like a reasonable position to take here.
    - derefr 8y ago
      > "They're your nodes, you paid for them" seems like a reasonable position to take here. If that were a reasonable position, you'd think AWS RDS and Google Cloud SQL would give you superuser access to your database instances to do things like installing Postgres extensions. It seems a lot of people are happy to pay for instances they can't even SSH into. :/
      - yebyen 8y ago
        Sure, I guess so, it's a value add. Your engineers can't mess anything up if they have no access at all.
        rthille 8y ago
        You underestimate our engineers :-)
      - outworlder 8y ago
        I don't even want to SSH to instances that I control and have provisioned, why would I want to SSH into instances managed by AWS? Unless the point of your server is to provide SSH (you are using it as a development box, maybe?), having to SSH means that you are lacking in the tooling department. At work we are guilty of that. We are actively trying to improve on this.

by yebyen 8y ago

allanbreyes 8y ago

HA seems like a poor choice as a default. I don't want to pay ~$150/month for dev and staging clusters, and I certainly don't need them to be HA. IIUC, Google/GKE and Microsoft/AKS are single-zone by default... free for masters, but not free for HA.

user5994461 8y ago
Google and Amazon are enterprise services. If you consider $150 too expensive, you are not part of the target customers.
- yebyen 8y ago
  The Google GKE offering can operate with a single g1-small worker. That's $0.0257/hr or $0.0070/hr preemptible. $5/mo minimum* This is not even the same ballpark. *(to be fair, the $5/mo minimum does not include a private network and a load balancer, and you will almost definitely need both in order to actually do anything with a cluster.)
  - nat 8y ago
    You're thinking like a human. There are plenty of organizations where $5/mo and $150/mo are essentially indistinguishable and would not affect decision making in any way.
    - yebyen 8y ago
      That's $150/mo before you even launch a single worker tho. I don't know about you, but I'd personally rather pay the $5 if I don't need a serious cluster yet. How much in actual absolute dollars do you think this is going to cost you, just in order to figure out exactly how it works, and what other AWS widgets you'll also need to pay for in order to use it effectively? I am a human, basically looking for a stepping stone on some actual cloud to land on that is comparable to Minikube, and this sure isn't it.
      - deleted 8y ago
        [deleted]
      - yebyen 8y ago
        I'm pretty clearly in the minority with my opinion here, and I recognize that. Amazon has made a substantial investment in Kubernetes here and that is nothing to shrug at. They are entitled (and justified) to recoup it. It's fair to say that K8S is not for lightweights, too. AWS provides a fairly generous free tier and they are also justified to extract some payment from every user of their services that derives some non-negligible value. If you're using Kubernetes and you're not getting any value out of it, I think it's also fair to say that you're doing it wrong.
        user5994461 8y ago
        You're not in the minority. It's well understood that there are amateurs trying to use the expensive clouds and shave off every penny, while the main customers are enterprise customers who couldn't notice a thousand dollars more or less. It's just pointless for small users to argue about AWS costs. The service is not meant for them and it cannot fulfill their requirements.
thesandlord 8y ago
GKE is free for HA as well: https://cloudplatform.googleblog.com/2018/06/Regional-clusters-in-Google-Kubernetes-Engine-are-now-generally-available.html https://cloudplatform.googleblog.com/2018/06/Regional-cluste...
exelius 8y ago
Looks like they want companies to pay to avoid the platform lock-in that k8s helps you avoid...
idunno246 8y ago
Until recently gke was charging 0.15/ hour too, so aws is just a little behind https://cloudplatform.googleblog.com/2017/11/Cutting-Cluster-Management-Fees-on-Google-Kubernetes-Engine.html?m=1 https://cloudplatform.googleblog.com/2017/11/Cutting-Cluster...
- yebyen 8y ago
  Not only recently, but actually this was the cost until yesterday for GKE with HA masters distributed across AZs[1]! I only heard that this announcement from AWS was likely coming this morning, over here in the thread about upgrading GKE clusters[2]. Given how long we've waited since the announcement at November's re:Invent, there's honestly not a lot that seems terribly rushed about this news, but I bet that AWS really would have liked to have Ingress controllers that are integrated with ALB ready for this announcement to go with their CNI plugins. "Why am I waiting for Amazon to get out of preview when Google's been giving it away this whole time?" For AWS customers that aren't locked in, that seems like a reasonable train of thought. [1]: https://cloudplatform.googleblog.com/2018/06/Regional-clusters-in-Google-Kubernetes-Engine-are-now-generally-available.html https://cloudplatform.googleblog.com/2018/06/Regional-cluste... [2]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17236794 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17236794

stingraycharles 8y ago

I look at this more as a product catering to existing AWS customers (and not have them move to GC) rather than trying to lure GC customers over to AWS.

Rapzid 8y ago

Ouch, no option to schedule pods onto the control plane for small clusters?

thesandlord 8y ago
AFAIK, none of the big three cloud providers (GKE,AKS,EKS) lets you do this.
- yebyen 8y ago
  Yeah, none of the rest of the big three are asking you to pay anything for those masters at this point, though. "They're your nodes, you paid for them" seems like a reasonable position to take here.
  - derefr 8y ago
    > "They're your nodes, you paid for them" seems like a reasonable position to take here. If that were a reasonable position, you'd think AWS RDS and Google Cloud SQL would give you superuser access to your database instances to do things like installing Postgres extensions. It seems a lot of people are happy to pay for instances they can't even SSH into. :/
    - yebyen 8y ago
      Sure, I guess so, it's a value add. Your engineers can't mess anything up if they have no access at all.
      - rthille 8y ago
        You underestimate our engineers :-)
    - outworlder 8y ago
      I don't even want to SSH to instances that I control and have provisioned, why would I want to SSH into instances managed by AWS? Unless the point of your server is to provide SSH (you are using it as a development box, maybe?), having to SSH means that you are lacking in the tooling department. At work we are guilty of that. We are actively trying to improve on this.