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What are the key features of a Tesla Model 3 that make people wait several years for their car instead of just going to a car dealership and buying what is avai

by TekMol 8y ago

What are the key features of a Tesla Model 3 that make people wait several years for their car instead of just going to a car dealership and buying what is available right now?

ryanhuff 8y ago
Here are a few: 1. Dealerships (experience) suck 2. Gas (petrol) sucks 3. Limited range sucks 4. Good performance is a plus
freerobby 8y ago
1. Convenience of all electric (start every day w/ "full tank", no oil changes or other regular maintenance) 2a. Social mission of the company/product 2b. Carbon footprint per mile driven gets better with age of car, rather than worse like with an ICE. 3. Autopilot 4. FSD hardware ready (even if you don't believe this, it's an advertised feature and may motivate some buyers) 5. No dealing with car salespeople
- TekMol 8y ago
  So electric+autopilot+online. Are there no other electric cars available? Are they not online? Do they have no autopilot?
  - freerobby 8y ago
    The Bolt fits the EV bill if you just need a commuter car. If you want to be able to take a road trip, Tesla is the only serious option. No manufacturer offers anything remotely competitive with Autopilot. Hopefully both of these things change very soon.
    - stephengillie 8y ago
      > No manufacturer offers anything remotely competitive with Autopilot. This is for the better, given the number of collisions occurring with Autopilot engaged or recently engaged. It's too bad the Adaptive Cruise and Autonomous Braking can't be enabled without the Lane Assist. Adaptive Cruise in a Camry Hybrid is a serious benefit and a life-changing amenity. I'm no longer willing to drive cars that don't have Adaptive Cruise.
      - freerobby 8y ago
        > This is for the better, given the number of collisions occurring with Autopilot engaged or recently engaged. I think this is very misguided. Tesla owners aren't suicidal or some big idiot collective. They understand Autopilot's practical intricacies (from experience) better than any other group. They continue to use it because they know it massively reduces driving fatigue. > It's too bad the Adaptive Cruise and Autonomous Braking can't be enabled without the Lane Assist. ACC and emergency braking work just fine without Lane Assist! One pull on the stalk for ACC; two for Autopilot.
        danso 8y ago
        Do they? https://twitter.com/zedd/status/1002244316087992320 https://twitter.com/zedd/status/1002244316087992320 This person attributes AP to saving his life when he fell asleep at the wheel. But AP is not meant to be some kind of fail-safe for impaired driving. Had he crashed, wouldn't Tesla blame the driver, as they have in every other AP crash?
        freerobby 8y ago
        Look, people fall asleep driving cars every day. People text and drive, eat hamburgers and drive, wear headphones and drive all the time. For whatever reason, when they do this stuff in a Tesla, critics claim that Autopilot made them do it. I don't excuse this behavior from any driver, but all things equal, a driver who does this will fare better with Autopilot than without it. I don't see a contradiction in your questions. Yes, Autopilot appeared to save this person from injury or death. Yes, Tesla would blame him if it hadn't. And yes, they'd be justified in doing so, because it would be his own fault for falling asleep at the wheel. Autopilot, like emergency braking, can mitigate a bad situation. But should it fail, it doesn't relieve you of responsibility for getting yourself into that situation in the first place.
        deleted 8y ago
        [deleted]
        8y ago
    - bonestamp2 8y ago
      Systems from Volvo, BMW and Mercedes are pretty close. Cadillac's system is arguably better than autopilot on the freeway, but it only supports freeways. So, I'm not sure if "remotely" is the right word... there are a few that are pretty close.
- asdsa5325 8y ago
  > Social mission of the company/product What is your opinion on Elon's plan to "rate" journalists? (He was upset about "unfair" coverage of Tesla.)
  - freerobby 8y ago
    Sloppy reporting and bad journalistic incentives are real problems, but Elon's solution is uncharacteristically dumb. Even outright falsehoods can be difficult to refute, let alone subtler varieties like "lies of omission." Few folks will see them for what they are. As for Tesla coverage, my observation is that Elon is usually correct on the merits of his frustrations, but he always responds in the most defensive and tonedeaf way possible. I think he forgets that the people he needs to convince aren't the ones attacking him, but the ones watching from the sidelines. I consider myself a huge fan of his, and the way he comports himself often makes me sad. My biggest pet peeve is that sometimes he'll cite a half-truth rather than a real truth, even when the real truth is on his side. His defense of Autopilot is a good example -- the data showing that Autopilot reduced crashes by 40% is very compelling, but he continues to cite the 1:340M miles stat which at best has a bunch of lurking variables. I understand why he does it -- it's easier to explain and it provides a baseline against the field rather than against Tesla's pre-AP vehicles. But it's dishonest, which is a bad look, especially when you're getting all pissy at the media for its dishonesty.
  - throwaway5752 8y ago
    For better or worse, in a $50ish billion dollar company with the short position that TSLA has, there is a lot of working the refs, as far as the press goes. He's doing it embarassingly clumsily, but he's wise to be aggressive about it.
ivraatiems 8y ago
Price for the Tesla brand. The other options that are also Teslas are much more expensive (and, in the case of the Model X, much larger). There are no other "prestige" fully-electric vehicles with the same wide popularity, except for ultra-high-end options like Fisker.
- s2g 8y ago
  They are coming, and fast. i-pace looks so good.
xeromal 8y ago
It's the coolest electric car on the market right now at a decent price. The other ones look like garbage. I'd place the Chevy Volt as second.
- zamalek 8y ago
  > Chevy Volt That's not bad at all. The garbage-looking EVs are what essentially forced me down the route of hybrid.
  - slfnflctd 8y ago
    The engineer in me says hybrids are overcomplicated and have more failure points. However, the researcher and accountant in me has been surprised to discover that hybrids are, in fact, the best consumer proposition in this category by far and will probably continue to be for a while.
  - xeromal 8y ago
    Yeah, I hate hatchbacks and bean looking EVs. IDK why those are the only ones being made.
- penglish1 8y ago
  "on the market" isn't.. really. If you're guaranteed a wait. So, to rephrase your reply: "It is so cool it is worth waiting for, versus the other ones which look so much like garbage, they aren't worth having right now."
  - xeromal 8y ago
    I meant Tesla in general. You can get a slick S used for about 40-50k.
chemmail 8y ago
This guy has never driven an electric car. I used to be a muscle car guy. I barely drive mine anymore since going to electric.

by TekMol 8y ago

What are the key features of a Tesla Model 3 that make people wait several years for their car instead of just going to a car dealership and buying what is available right now?

ryanhuff 8y ago

Here are a few: 1. Dealerships (experience) suck 2. Gas (petrol) sucks 3. Limited range sucks 4. Good performance is a plus

freerobby 8y ago

1. Convenience of all electric (start every day w/ "full tank", no oil changes or other regular maintenance) 2a. Social mission of the company/product 2b. Carbon footprint per mile driven gets better with age of car, rather than worse like with an ICE. 3. Autopilot 4. FSD hardware ready (even if you don't believe this, it's an advertised feature and may motivate some buyers) 5. No dealing with car salespeople

TekMol 8y ago
So electric+autopilot+online. Are there no other electric cars available? Are they not online? Do they have no autopilot?
- freerobby 8y ago
  The Bolt fits the EV bill if you just need a commuter car. If you want to be able to take a road trip, Tesla is the only serious option. No manufacturer offers anything remotely competitive with Autopilot. Hopefully both of these things change very soon.
  - stephengillie 8y ago
    > No manufacturer offers anything remotely competitive with Autopilot. This is for the better, given the number of collisions occurring with Autopilot engaged or recently engaged. It's too bad the Adaptive Cruise and Autonomous Braking can't be enabled without the Lane Assist. Adaptive Cruise in a Camry Hybrid is a serious benefit and a life-changing amenity. I'm no longer willing to drive cars that don't have Adaptive Cruise.
    - freerobby 8y ago
      > This is for the better, given the number of collisions occurring with Autopilot engaged or recently engaged. I think this is very misguided. Tesla owners aren't suicidal or some big idiot collective. They understand Autopilot's practical intricacies (from experience) better than any other group. They continue to use it because they know it massively reduces driving fatigue. > It's too bad the Adaptive Cruise and Autonomous Braking can't be enabled without the Lane Assist. ACC and emergency braking work just fine without Lane Assist! One pull on the stalk for ACC; two for Autopilot.
      - danso 8y ago
        Do they? https://twitter.com/zedd/status/1002244316087992320 https://twitter.com/zedd/status/1002244316087992320 This person attributes AP to saving his life when he fell asleep at the wheel. But AP is not meant to be some kind of fail-safe for impaired driving. Had he crashed, wouldn't Tesla blame the driver, as they have in every other AP crash?
        freerobby 8y ago
        Look, people fall asleep driving cars every day. People text and drive, eat hamburgers and drive, wear headphones and drive all the time. For whatever reason, when they do this stuff in a Tesla, critics claim that Autopilot made them do it. I don't excuse this behavior from any driver, but all things equal, a driver who does this will fare better with Autopilot than without it. I don't see a contradiction in your questions. Yes, Autopilot appeared to save this person from injury or death. Yes, Tesla would blame him if it hadn't. And yes, they'd be justified in doing so, because it would be his own fault for falling asleep at the wheel. Autopilot, like emergency braking, can mitigate a bad situation. But should it fail, it doesn't relieve you of responsibility for getting yourself into that situation in the first place.
        deleted 8y ago
        [deleted]
        8y ago
  - bonestamp2 8y ago
    Systems from Volvo, BMW and Mercedes are pretty close. Cadillac's system is arguably better than autopilot on the freeway, but it only supports freeways. So, I'm not sure if "remotely" is the right word... there are a few that are pretty close.
asdsa5325 8y ago
> Social mission of the company/product What is your opinion on Elon's plan to "rate" journalists? (He was upset about "unfair" coverage of Tesla.)
- freerobby 8y ago
  Sloppy reporting and bad journalistic incentives are real problems, but Elon's solution is uncharacteristically dumb. Even outright falsehoods can be difficult to refute, let alone subtler varieties like "lies of omission." Few folks will see them for what they are. As for Tesla coverage, my observation is that Elon is usually correct on the merits of his frustrations, but he always responds in the most defensive and tonedeaf way possible. I think he forgets that the people he needs to convince aren't the ones attacking him, but the ones watching from the sidelines. I consider myself a huge fan of his, and the way he comports himself often makes me sad. My biggest pet peeve is that sometimes he'll cite a half-truth rather than a real truth, even when the real truth is on his side. His defense of Autopilot is a good example -- the data showing that Autopilot reduced crashes by 40% is very compelling, but he continues to cite the 1:340M miles stat which at best has a bunch of lurking variables. I understand why he does it -- it's easier to explain and it provides a baseline against the field rather than against Tesla's pre-AP vehicles. But it's dishonest, which is a bad look, especially when you're getting all pissy at the media for its dishonesty.
- throwaway5752 8y ago
  For better or worse, in a $50ish billion dollar company with the short position that TSLA has, there is a lot of working the refs, as far as the press goes. He's doing it embarassingly clumsily, but he's wise to be aggressive about it.

ivraatiems 8y ago

Price for the Tesla brand. The other options that are also Teslas are much more expensive (and, in the case of the Model X, much larger). There are no other "prestige" fully-electric vehicles with the same wide popularity, except for ultra-high-end options like Fisker.

s2g 8y ago
They are coming, and fast. i-pace looks so good.

xeromal 8y ago

It's the coolest electric car on the market right now at a decent price. The other ones look like garbage. I'd place the Chevy Volt as second.

zamalek 8y ago
> Chevy Volt That's not bad at all. The garbage-looking EVs are what essentially forced me down the route of hybrid.
- slfnflctd 8y ago
  The engineer in me says hybrids are overcomplicated and have more failure points. However, the researcher and accountant in me has been surprised to discover that hybrids are, in fact, the best consumer proposition in this category by far and will probably continue to be for a while.
- xeromal 8y ago
  Yeah, I hate hatchbacks and bean looking EVs. IDK why those are the only ones being made.
penglish1 8y ago
"on the market" isn't.. really. If you're guaranteed a wait. So, to rephrase your reply: "It is so cool it is worth waiting for, versus the other ones which look so much like garbage, they aren't worth having right now."
- xeromal 8y ago
  I meant Tesla in general. You can get a slick S used for about 40-50k.

chemmail 8y ago

This guy has never driven an electric car. I used to be a muscle car guy. I barely drive mine anymore since going to electric.