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The Bolt, Leaf, and i3 are all fairly ugly. Most of the people I know waiting for Model 3s are doing so in part because it's actually a decent to good looking s
by djrogers 8y ago
The Bolt, Leaf, and i3 are all fairly ugly. Most of the people I know waiting for Model 3s are doing so in part because it's actually a decent to good looking sedan, and not a weird jelly bean hatchback.
- toomuchtodo 8y agoAnd no SuperCharging network.
- Someone1234 8y agoThere are plenty of non-proprietary charges around these days. For example go here (and turn off Tesla): https://chargehub.com/en/charging-stations-map.html https://chargehub.com/en/charging-stations-map.html
- mikeash 8y agoThere are still not a lot of good options for long distance travel. Third party fast chargers are usually slow, broken, busy, or badly located.
- LeoPanthera 8y agoThis is a weird thing to say. It's simply not true. Search PlugShare for CHAdeMO chargers. There are a lot.
- mikeash 8y agoCHAdeMO is typically 50kW or less, sometimes just 20kW. They’re often unmaintained and left broken for long periods of time. They’re often installed in single units, leaving you vulnerable to being screwed by another user or someone blocking the spot. They’re usually installed in cities rather than along highways. Many important corridors don’t have enough CHAdeMO coverage for a long trip.
- LeoPanthera 8y agoI'd love to see some citations for these claims. Otherwise it just sounds like you have an agenda.
- mikeash 8y agoThis comes from personal experience. If you want something more solid, PlugShare will show you. Go look at how they’re distributed, how many chargers are installed at each location, and what kind of speeds people report.
- dangrossman 8y agoI'm in a suburb of Philadelphia. I've driven round trip to Harrisburg, Philadelphia, Atlantic City NJ, Baltimore MD on those CHAdeMO chargers. Always 50 kW available, always working, never blocked, for the 3+ years I've driven two different EVs (currently an '18 Leaf). The networks all have realtime status via their apps/websites, there's no guessing about whether a charger is working or in-use. The distribution is fking fantastic: most of them are right at the rest stops on the PA turnpike or I95 and other highways, so you don't even get off the highway to charge. Tesla puts theirs in strip malls, so you have to go through a toll, exit the highway, drive through a town, charge, drive back to the highway, go through the toll again to resume your trip. I work from home with no commute, but I put over 1000 miles a month on my Leaf because it's a great road trip car: a smoother, quieter ride than most luxury cars, that drives itself most of the time with ProPilot, with a nearly 10x larger charging network than Tesla's. Nissan throws in two years of free charging with new Leafs, so for the most part these road trips cost nothing too.
- mikeash 8y agoThose aren’t exactly long trips. A long range EV can do those without charging at all. 50kW is still slow. I consider Supercharger speeds to be the bare minimum.
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- toomuchtodo 8y agoAs mikeash mentions, anything non-Tesla for charging is either slow, broken, or unreliable.
- Reason077 8y agoThis depends on your location. Norway and the Netherlands have fantastic non-Tesla charging networks. And the UK is improving rapidly with good coverage of reliable chargers in most parts of the country (still no >50kW chargers however).
- toomuchtodo 8y agoTo your point, no >50kW chargers. Superchargers are 100-135kW. I’m in the US, and the charging networks outside of Tesla’s are fragmented and unreliable.
- bsdpqwz 8y agofastned in the Netherlands has 175kW charging stations (not all of them), and just they announced their first 350kW one: https://fastned.nl/en/blog/post/fastned-onthult-nieuwe-generatie-snellaadstations https://fastned.nl/en/blog/post/fastned-onthult-nieuwe-gener...
- toomuchtodo 8y ago> And the UK is improving rapidly with good coverage of reliable chargers in most parts of the country (still no >50kW chargers however).
- NikolaNovak 8y agoRight, but that's a fairly personal and perhaps even cultural thing. When Chevy Bolt came out, virtually every north american automotive magazine slammed its looks; and virtually every European immigrant friend of mine absolutely loved them. Similarly, the Sedan nature of Tesla3 appeals to a lot of my 4th-generation-Canadian or -American colleagues, but screams impracticality and poor visibility to others. Like the UI (the all-touchscreen paradigm is a HUGE deal breaker for me - I want buttons and levers I can operate without looking), the design is not universal :) (edit: note that I'm carefully not saying anything about the i3... I have yet to meet a person even anecdotally who loves it for its looks - maybe it's just too ahead of its time ;-)
- crwalker 8y agoAnecdata: I love the i3 for its looks (do not own one).
- IOT_Apprentice 8y agoThey may be ugly, but they are here now and working. Love the 233 mile range on the Bolt after coming from the 78 mile range of a SmartED. Also the 10" touch screen with car play is sublime. So much better than the non-touch carplay in a Mercedes 250/300. Also bluetooth door/trunk open/lock. Can't wait to see what range is like in 3 years when lease is up on new EVs.
- sanderjd 8y agoThe new Leaf looks like a normal car, which is all a lot of (I suspect most) people want.
- briandear 8y agoThe Audi A3 e-tron isn't ugly at all. It's pretty beautiful for a 4 door hatchback.
- ferongr 8y agoNothing says "beautiful" like having to fumble with a touchscreen to adjust the air vents.
- unclebucknasty 8y agoHow about fumbling with the air vents to adjust the air vents?
- LeoPanthera 8y agoI acknowledge that taste is subjective but maybe you are referring to last year's Leaf? You're the first person I've heard say they don't like the look of the 2018 Leaf. https://cnet1.cbsistatic.com/img/dSKLWFx0d35FPHtPvpJJg0dRBcs=/461x336:2701x1595/2017/09/05/67b621a9-9606-4a0a-999d-2c8b7aeb4e75/2018-nissan-leaf-8.jpg https://cnet1.cbsistatic.com/img/dSKLWFx0d35FPHtPvpJJg0dRBcs... (Disclaimer: I own one.)
- djrogers 8y agoYou’re the first person I’ve heard to claim it’s not ugly. From the Gillette razor looking faux air splitter, to whatever the heck they’re doing with that C pillar, it’s a complete mess. And that’s from someone who generally likes hatchbacks!
- stephengillie 8y agoBlocky nose, plain interior, and panel gaps? The Model 3 is about as attractive and utilitarian as a Taurus. No nice lines like a 1970s Porsche or Dart, and doesn't look nimble like a Civic or Corolla. The people who buy it for appearance are likely the same ones spending $78,000 to "save money on gasoline".
- pooya13 8y agoThey seem to have since resolved the panel gap issues of the early production cars.