5 ms·

I’ve seen many acquisitions commit to 2) only to slowly walk back from that “in the interests of operational efficiencies”. And next thing you know you have to

I’ve seen many acquisitions commit to 2) only to slowly walk back from that “in the interests of operational efficiencies”. And next thing you know you have to change over to using a Microsoft account to log in...

baldfat 8y ago
What would be wrong having a Microsoft account to log in exactly? They aren't getting any more information from you then they have currently purchased. I remember when I had a YouTube account, a blogger account and a Google account and I am glad I just use one google account myself.
- snowwolf 8y ago
  Because it’s an indicator of a loss of independence. And if you went through the Skype changeover you’ll know exactly what a fiasco that change to a Microsoft account was.
  - baldfat 8y ago
    You mean from 2011 when Microsoft had totally different management and business model? I don't see the Steve Ballmer Microsoft has much bearing on today's Microsoft. Also it wasn't the Microsoft Account change as much as the they had the weird MS Store or Local account sign in options. I removed the Store sign in and only used local and had no issues. Am I missing something?
    - zeth___ 8y ago
      Jesus Christ. Is everyone here a teenager? Microsoft in the 80s might bot be a valid comparison today, but something that happened 6 years ago is barely yesterday. Institutions do not change that much that quickly. Microsoft 15 minutes ago isn't the Microsoft of today is just as true a statement and one just as vacuous.
      - baldfat 8y ago
        I'm closer to 50 and certainly not a teenager. Yes, Steve was the issue and his style was old fashion. There is no going back once you open up the shed. Why do people continue to want to punish a company for their past when their present has been so good? To keep punishing them and not rewarding them for their good deeds? P.S. I thought the whole anti-OpenSUSE movement was also plain old stupid.
        zeth___ 8y ago
        On my evil list Micrisoft is better than Google and Facebook. But worse than Github. If I heard Microsoft was buying Oracle I'd be dancing in the streets.
        executesorder66 8y ago
        > their present has been so good - Putting adverts directly into their OS (which people pay for by the way) - Forcing their shitty updates, (and restarts) at the most inconvenient times - making it impossible to permanently and easily turn off telemetry Wow, you have low standards. I bet if you ate dog shit, you'd say it's not so bad.
        baldfat 8y ago
        So Windows 10 isn't leaps and bounds better than Windows 7 or Windows 98???? Seriously Windows 10 is the first Windows I have ever actually liked. I got my OpenSUSE terminal open and using ranger and my other terminal programs working in Windows (At work I have to have Windows due to many issues on one computer) > Forcing their shitty updates, (and restarts) at the most inconvenient times Weird I have a pop up that says there is an update coming and when do I want to schedule it.... >Putting adverts directly into their OS (which people pay for by the way) Didn't care for it and I hit the disable on 3 switches > making it impossible to permanently and easily turn off telemetry They did push out an update over a year ago that makes it so you don't have to use the tools that were out since 2015. Telemetry was specific for Inside program and beta but I certainly see why people were freaking out. I looked at what was being collected and it seemed fine for me.
- lostapathy 8y ago
  Because the whole "live" account thing is a total mess on their other properties that support it, and github's login system is great?
- megaman22 8y ago
  Microsoft accounts are a trainwreck... I've got at least three or four of them all with the same email address, and despite years of effort to link them together and consolidate, I still have to use all of them to log into different services and access different resources. The permissioning on things like Azure and VSTS doesn't make a lick of sense.
  - reitanqild 8y ago
    Google kind of managed to force most accounts together. ;-) In the process it seems they managed to seriously undermine their new, really really nice social network by using the same name for that and now me and a few others have a nice social network all to ourselves :-\
  - dcow 8y ago
    I began the process of creating an Azure account recently and somehow the Canada region was selected. The system locked my email address into Canada even though I already have a US region live account with the same email address. Since I don't have a Canadian zip code, I can't submit billing information and complete the provisioning process. I was willing to try Azure for a new project, but now I'm not because their accounts are such a mess. I talked with a project support technician for Azure who actually understood the issue but was unable to resolve it suggestion I use a different email address. I know I could, but on principle I won't. I'm actually really excited about MS+GitHub, but have to agree the account situation sucks.
  - raarts 8y ago
    > Microsoft accounts are a train wreck. Now you put it like this, I realize I suffer from this too. The UX of having accounts in the Microsoft ecosystem sucks severely.
reitanqild 8y ago
WhatsApp and a number of Apple and Google aquisitions comes to mind in addition to Microsofts own Skype. (Although, IIRC except for WhatsApp most of these didn't make many promises.)
ocdtrekkie 8y ago
I actually just made a bet with a friend on whether or not they'd switch GitHub over to Microsoft logins. My strong bet (that I put money behind) is that they won't. They're specifically acquiring this to win over developers and community, and they should hopefully know from the Skype transition how much negative perception that granted them. Their absolute best bet is to sit on GitHub, feed it money, offer the paid features as an additional perk for MSDN subscribers through an account linking method, and call it a day. The developer goodwill they can buy being a good steward of GitHub far surpasses any other value they could extract from it.
- jodrellblank 8y ago
  Microsoft has you use a Microsoft account to sign into Windows itself; I think they will merge Github in somehow. They might be trying to win over developers, but they'll want to cross-sell to MS ecosystem developers as well. Starting with "any existing Microsoft account is now a valid Github login". Then maybe "you can more easily use VS (or VS Code) with Github and deploy to Azure, if you use a Microsoft account with Github" and "you can merge your Github account into your Microsoft account". Then "all new accounts on Github are Microsoft accounts, you can no longer make a separate one". Whether they go all the way to "there's no such thing as a separate Github account anymore", not soon, but probably one day - they've been trying to centralize accounts between all their services for years and years, haven't they?
  - ocdtrekkie 8y ago
    Their "for years and years" strategy though has not been working.
  - scarface74 8y ago
    It's already trivial to host on GitHub and deploy on Azure using Visual Studio Team Services - in your deployment pipeline you choose github as your source repository instead of the built in git repo that's part of VSTS. It works using web hooks just like every other CI/CD tool.
- DoofusOfDeath 8y ago
Wurdan 8y ago
Having seen a big Microsoft acquisition from the inside, I can also tell you that this dynamic occurs: Microsoft is a gigantic organisation with very good working conditions. This leads to people with very long tenures working in highly defined and specialised roles within the company. Career development does happen, and is actively encouraged by Microsoft, but you're usually moving into a role which is just as niche as your last. When a major acquisition occurs of a smaller organisation, it's usually done with a promise of keeping independent leadership and a degree of organisational separation. However, as middle-management staff rotate out of the smaller company naturally, the roles that they vacate are very attractive to Microsoft employees who want to have a bit more of that start-up feeling, and a slightly wider remit to make change. So through a kind of organisational osmotic pressure, even if the leadership of the acquired company remains independent, the middle ranks of the acquired company become permeated by life-long Microsoft-ers. None of this is particularly bad - I just want to make it clear that Microsoft's definition of independence is not everyone's definition thereof.
- krylon 8y ago
  > organisational osmotic pressure OT, but I love that term!
glenneroo 8y ago
...which one year is a Microsoft account, the next it's live.com, then msn.com, then passport.com, then outlook.com. And what about that 20-year old MSDN account, which was always associated with Hotmail? You can login but it hangs on some obscure error message. Googling suggest to associate with a non-Hotmail address, but that one doesn't let me access MSDN subscriptions. Next forum suggestion: create a VisualStudio.com login and link with Live.com... but it still doesn't work. Several support emails later, I just need to delete all existing associated MSDN email accounts and start over with my work email address. I just wonder how long until I need to migrate again to the next email/login-flavor-of-the-year. Maybe I'm just an edge case?

baldfat 8y ago

What would be wrong having a Microsoft account to log in exactly? They aren't getting any more information from you then they have currently purchased. I remember when I had a YouTube account, a blogger account and a Google account and I am glad I just use one google account myself.

snowwolf 8y ago
Because it’s an indicator of a loss of independence. And if you went through the Skype changeover you’ll know exactly what a fiasco that change to a Microsoft account was.
- baldfat 8y ago
  You mean from 2011 when Microsoft had totally different management and business model? I don't see the Steve Ballmer Microsoft has much bearing on today's Microsoft. Also it wasn't the Microsoft Account change as much as the they had the weird MS Store or Local account sign in options. I removed the Store sign in and only used local and had no issues. Am I missing something?
  - zeth___ 8y ago
    Jesus Christ. Is everyone here a teenager? Microsoft in the 80s might bot be a valid comparison today, but something that happened 6 years ago is barely yesterday. Institutions do not change that much that quickly. Microsoft 15 minutes ago isn't the Microsoft of today is just as true a statement and one just as vacuous.
    - baldfat 8y ago
      I'm closer to 50 and certainly not a teenager. Yes, Steve was the issue and his style was old fashion. There is no going back once you open up the shed. Why do people continue to want to punish a company for their past when their present has been so good? To keep punishing them and not rewarding them for their good deeds? P.S. I thought the whole anti-OpenSUSE movement was also plain old stupid.
      - zeth___ 8y ago
        On my evil list Micrisoft is better than Google and Facebook. But worse than Github. If I heard Microsoft was buying Oracle I'd be dancing in the streets.
      - executesorder66 8y ago
        > their present has been so good - Putting adverts directly into their OS (which people pay for by the way) - Forcing their shitty updates, (and restarts) at the most inconvenient times - making it impossible to permanently and easily turn off telemetry Wow, you have low standards. I bet if you ate dog shit, you'd say it's not so bad.
        baldfat 8y ago
        So Windows 10 isn't leaps and bounds better than Windows 7 or Windows 98???? Seriously Windows 10 is the first Windows I have ever actually liked. I got my OpenSUSE terminal open and using ranger and my other terminal programs working in Windows (At work I have to have Windows due to many issues on one computer) > Forcing their shitty updates, (and restarts) at the most inconvenient times Weird I have a pop up that says there is an update coming and when do I want to schedule it.... >Putting adverts directly into their OS (which people pay for by the way) Didn't care for it and I hit the disable on 3 switches > making it impossible to permanently and easily turn off telemetry They did push out an update over a year ago that makes it so you don't have to use the tools that were out since 2015. Telemetry was specific for Inside program and beta but I certainly see why people were freaking out. I looked at what was being collected and it seemed fine for me.
lostapathy 8y ago
Because the whole "live" account thing is a total mess on their other properties that support it, and github's login system is great?
megaman22 8y ago
Microsoft accounts are a trainwreck... I've got at least three or four of them all with the same email address, and despite years of effort to link them together and consolidate, I still have to use all of them to log into different services and access different resources. The permissioning on things like Azure and VSTS doesn't make a lick of sense.
- reitanqild 8y ago
  Google kind of managed to force most accounts together. ;-) In the process it seems they managed to seriously undermine their new, really really nice social network by using the same name for that and now me and a few others have a nice social network all to ourselves :-\
- dcow 8y ago
  I began the process of creating an Azure account recently and somehow the Canada region was selected. The system locked my email address into Canada even though I already have a US region live account with the same email address. Since I don't have a Canadian zip code, I can't submit billing information and complete the provisioning process. I was willing to try Azure for a new project, but now I'm not because their accounts are such a mess. I talked with a project support technician for Azure who actually understood the issue but was unable to resolve it suggestion I use a different email address. I know I could, but on principle I won't. I'm actually really excited about MS+GitHub, but have to agree the account situation sucks.
- raarts 8y ago
  > Microsoft accounts are a train wreck. Now you put it like this, I realize I suffer from this too. The UX of having accounts in the Microsoft ecosystem sucks severely.

reitanqild 8y ago

WhatsApp and a number of Apple and Google aquisitions comes to mind in addition to Microsofts own Skype. (Although, IIRC except for WhatsApp most of these didn't make many promises.)

ocdtrekkie 8y ago

I actually just made a bet with a friend on whether or not they'd switch GitHub over to Microsoft logins. My strong bet (that I put money behind) is that they won't. They're specifically acquiring this to win over developers and community, and they should hopefully know from the Skype transition how much negative perception that granted them. Their absolute best bet is to sit on GitHub, feed it money, offer the paid features as an additional perk for MSDN subscribers through an account linking method, and call it a day. The developer goodwill they can buy being a good steward of GitHub far surpasses any other value they could extract from it.

jodrellblank 8y ago
Microsoft has you use a Microsoft account to sign into Windows itself; I think they will merge Github in somehow. They might be trying to win over developers, but they'll want to cross-sell to MS ecosystem developers as well. Starting with "any existing Microsoft account is now a valid Github login". Then maybe "you can more easily use VS (or VS Code) with Github and deploy to Azure, if you use a Microsoft account with Github" and "you can merge your Github account into your Microsoft account". Then "all new accounts on Github are Microsoft accounts, you can no longer make a separate one". Whether they go all the way to "there's no such thing as a separate Github account anymore", not soon, but probably one day - they've been trying to centralize accounts between all their services for years and years, haven't they?
- ocdtrekkie 8y ago
  Their "for years and years" strategy though has not been working.
- scarface74 8y ago
  It's already trivial to host on GitHub and deploy on Azure using Visual Studio Team Services - in your deployment pipeline you choose github as your source repository instead of the built in git repo that's part of VSTS. It works using web hooks just like every other CI/CD tool.
DoofusOfDeath 8y ago

Wurdan 8y ago

Having seen a big Microsoft acquisition from the inside, I can also tell you that this dynamic occurs: Microsoft is a gigantic organisation with very good working conditions. This leads to people with very long tenures working in highly defined and specialised roles within the company. Career development does happen, and is actively encouraged by Microsoft, but you're usually moving into a role which is just as niche as your last. When a major acquisition occurs of a smaller organisation, it's usually done with a promise of keeping independent leadership and a degree of organisational separation. However, as middle-management staff rotate out of the smaller company naturally, the roles that they vacate are very attractive to Microsoft employees who want to have a bit more of that start-up feeling, and a slightly wider remit to make change. So through a kind of organisational osmotic pressure, even if the leadership of the acquired company remains independent, the middle ranks of the acquired company become permeated by life-long Microsoft-ers. None of this is particularly bad - I just want to make it clear that Microsoft's definition of independence is not everyone's definition thereof.

krylon 8y ago
> organisational osmotic pressure OT, but I love that term!

glenneroo 8y ago

...which one year is a Microsoft account, the next it's live.com, then msn.com, then passport.com, then outlook.com. And what about that 20-year old MSDN account, which was always associated with Hotmail? You can login but it hangs on some obscure error message. Googling suggest to associate with a non-Hotmail address, but that one doesn't let me access MSDN subscriptions. Next forum suggestion: create a VisualStudio.com login and link with Live.com... but it still doesn't work. Several support emails later, I just need to delete all existing associated MSDN email accounts and start over with my work email address. I just wonder how long until I need to migrate again to the next email/login-flavor-of-the-year. Maybe I'm just an edge case?