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Facebook the website doesn't have much to offer, however 'everyone' has one, so its separate messenger app is still very widely used (at least in the U.K.) I'd

Facebook the website doesn't have much to offer, however 'everyone' has one, so its separate messenger app is still very widely used (at least in the U.K.) I'd be interested to know if this is the case in the U.S. as well.

Mogzol 8y ago
Messenger is definitely the most popular messaging app where I live (near Vancouver, Canada), and [1] seems to indicate that this is true for most of North America. WhatsApp is still the most popular messaging app worldwide though, although in my experience it is barely used in Canada/USA. [1] https://www.similarweb.com/blog/mobile-messaging-app-map-2018 https://www.similarweb.com/blog/mobile-messaging-app-map-201...
batiudrami 8y ago
I understand a lot of the US still uses SMS, hence the constant talk of iMessage. The rest of the world uses Whatsapp or Messenger, except Japan/China/Korea who primarily use their own clients. Nowadays the only SMS I get are 2FA codes.
- Pr3fix 8y ago
  iMessage between iMessage users is akin to Whatsapp/messenger -- not actually SMS/MMS. Those are only sent when, say, messaging an Android user or if an iMessage failed to deliver.
  - batiudrami 8y ago
    I know but for iPhone users it's more or less seamless other than that they know they have fewer features if the bubbles are green.
  - netsharc 8y ago
    iMessage came after WhatsApp (WA itself isn't the first messaging app...), I wonder why WA didn't get big in the US, maybe it's because virtually all mobile contracts in the US include a texting package. As for WA, one key to its success was probably the automatic upload of your address book to see who of your contacts is already in the system (and the privacy side in the battle of privacy vs convenience loses another battle), on other IM clients you had to add contacts manually.
    - amirmc 8y ago
      IIRC WhatsApp also cared a lot about making the app available on all kinds of phones. Not just iOS/Android. So all those people in the rest of the world could start using it and bring their families on board.
    - ptaipale 8y ago
      There are texting packages in European contracts as well, particularly in the more competitive markets in North Europe, but one reason to prefer WhatsApp is roaming: in the US, you can use your texting package all over the continent, but in Europe, you couldn't - whenever in a neighbour country, sending an SMS or an MMS could be very expensive, and what's worse, the price is unpredictable or even scammy. So it was better to use wifi and WhatsApp to communicate. Once you'd fixed your net access, you could be sure of cheap easy text communications. The EU roaming pricing law has now fixed the original cause, but it is too late to change people's behaviour.
    - slig 8y ago
      WA used to lie on the App Store / Play Store. It was something like "WhatsApp - Free SMS", when it never send or received SMSs.
    - joshuakarjala 8y ago
      WA is also practically non-existent in Denmark. If someone is one WA they are either an ex-pat or have lived extensive time abroad and have friends / family they keep in touch with. Here we also have unlimited texting in all but the most limited pay-as-you-go offerings. The telco market is extremely competitive.
- tallanvor 8y ago
  I'm not sure about that. I don't use Whatsapp at all anymore (and before that rarely). I'm more likely to use SMS with friends within Norway and Messenger for those who aren't in Norway.
- royroyroys 8y ago
  SMS I'm guessing is unlikely to be supported by a lot of services in future as 2FA over SMS isn't recommended by NIST (https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2016/08/nist_is_no_long.html https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2016/08/nist_is_no_lo...)
applecrazy 8y ago
I can attest to this (HS student). Although I specifically don't have an account, my peers definitely use FB as a means of communication, a way to publicize for school events, and organize group activities. The network effects run strong.
Spooky23 8y ago
Among my circle of friends and parents at school (K-8), Facebook is eroding as an ubiquitous platform. Many parents in certain professions feel that it is best avoided. iMessage, SMS is ruling the day now. It’s incredible how utterly Google failed in this space by tossing Talk.
- kbenson 8y ago
  I'm not sure how to interpret the idea that iMessage is doing it right but Google was wrong to shift from talk to hangouts. Hangouts is basically iMessage but you can actually reach the other half of the population that doesn't use Apple.
  - koko775 8y ago
    It's a closed system too, though.
    - kbenson 8y ago
      Yes. But if iMessage is presented as the success and as an example of what Google could have had part of if they only hadn't switched to hangouts, I'm not sure how it works as evidence since google switched to be more like iMessage. I'm not arguing that I think a system should or should not be open, just that I don't understand how the argument that was presented is supposed to work.
    - Spooky23 8y ago
      All communication systems are in the process of flipping back to closed systems. The major open ones (mail and POTS) are either going away as telcos divest and people stop answering the phone or consolidating into a small number of big players as what we see with email. The 2030s will probably bring back the future equivalent of Telex
  - Spooky23 8y ago
    Hangouts is yet another app. imesssge just works and gracefully degrades when a non iOS person is included.
methodover 8y ago
> Facebook the website doesn't have much to offer :thinking_face: Facebook offers an event planner, a blog platform, photo hosting, video hosting, news aggregation, venmo-like payment system, de-facto single sign on service for most websites That's in addition to Messenger, which as you said is huge.
- nine_k 8y ago
  The problem is that the blog and news platforms are not great. People often complain that they miss important posts. I suppose photo sharing is integrated in messenger (the mobile app), too?

Mogzol 8y ago

Messenger is definitely the most popular messaging app where I live (near Vancouver, Canada), and [1] seems to indicate that this is true for most of North America. WhatsApp is still the most popular messaging app worldwide though, although in my experience it is barely used in Canada/USA. [1] https://www.similarweb.com/blog/mobile-messaging-app-map-2018 https://www.similarweb.com/blog/mobile-messaging-app-map-201...

batiudrami 8y ago

I understand a lot of the US still uses SMS, hence the constant talk of iMessage. The rest of the world uses Whatsapp or Messenger, except Japan/China/Korea who primarily use their own clients. Nowadays the only SMS I get are 2FA codes.

Pr3fix 8y ago
iMessage between iMessage users is akin to Whatsapp/messenger -- not actually SMS/MMS. Those are only sent when, say, messaging an Android user or if an iMessage failed to deliver.
- batiudrami 8y ago
  I know but for iPhone users it's more or less seamless other than that they know they have fewer features if the bubbles are green.
- netsharc 8y ago
  iMessage came after WhatsApp (WA itself isn't the first messaging app...), I wonder why WA didn't get big in the US, maybe it's because virtually all mobile contracts in the US include a texting package. As for WA, one key to its success was probably the automatic upload of your address book to see who of your contacts is already in the system (and the privacy side in the battle of privacy vs convenience loses another battle), on other IM clients you had to add contacts manually.
  - amirmc 8y ago
    IIRC WhatsApp also cared a lot about making the app available on all kinds of phones. Not just iOS/Android. So all those people in the rest of the world could start using it and bring their families on board.
  - ptaipale 8y ago
    There are texting packages in European contracts as well, particularly in the more competitive markets in North Europe, but one reason to prefer WhatsApp is roaming: in the US, you can use your texting package all over the continent, but in Europe, you couldn't - whenever in a neighbour country, sending an SMS or an MMS could be very expensive, and what's worse, the price is unpredictable or even scammy. So it was better to use wifi and WhatsApp to communicate. Once you'd fixed your net access, you could be sure of cheap easy text communications. The EU roaming pricing law has now fixed the original cause, but it is too late to change people's behaviour.
  - slig 8y ago
    WA used to lie on the App Store / Play Store. It was something like "WhatsApp - Free SMS", when it never send or received SMSs.
  - joshuakarjala 8y ago
    WA is also practically non-existent in Denmark. If someone is one WA they are either an ex-pat or have lived extensive time abroad and have friends / family they keep in touch with. Here we also have unlimited texting in all but the most limited pay-as-you-go offerings. The telco market is extremely competitive.
tallanvor 8y ago
I'm not sure about that. I don't use Whatsapp at all anymore (and before that rarely). I'm more likely to use SMS with friends within Norway and Messenger for those who aren't in Norway.
royroyroys 8y ago
SMS I'm guessing is unlikely to be supported by a lot of services in future as 2FA over SMS isn't recommended by NIST (https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2016/08/nist_is_no_long.html https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2016/08/nist_is_no_lo...)

applecrazy 8y ago

I can attest to this (HS student). Although I specifically don't have an account, my peers definitely use FB as a means of communication, a way to publicize for school events, and organize group activities. The network effects run strong.

Spooky23 8y ago

Among my circle of friends and parents at school (K-8), Facebook is eroding as an ubiquitous platform. Many parents in certain professions feel that it is best avoided. iMessage, SMS is ruling the day now. It’s incredible how utterly Google failed in this space by tossing Talk.

kbenson 8y ago
I'm not sure how to interpret the idea that iMessage is doing it right but Google was wrong to shift from talk to hangouts. Hangouts is basically iMessage but you can actually reach the other half of the population that doesn't use Apple.
- koko775 8y ago
  It's a closed system too, though.
  - kbenson 8y ago
    Yes. But if iMessage is presented as the success and as an example of what Google could have had part of if they only hadn't switched to hangouts, I'm not sure how it works as evidence since google switched to be more like iMessage. I'm not arguing that I think a system should or should not be open, just that I don't understand how the argument that was presented is supposed to work.
  - Spooky23 8y ago
    All communication systems are in the process of flipping back to closed systems. The major open ones (mail and POTS) are either going away as telcos divest and people stop answering the phone or consolidating into a small number of big players as what we see with email. The 2030s will probably bring back the future equivalent of Telex
- Spooky23 8y ago
  Hangouts is yet another app. imesssge just works and gracefully degrades when a non iOS person is included.

methodover 8y ago

> Facebook the website doesn't have much to offer :thinking_face: Facebook offers an event planner, a blog platform, photo hosting, video hosting, news aggregation, venmo-like payment system, de-facto single sign on service for most websites That's in addition to Messenger, which as you said is huge.

nine_k 8y ago
The problem is that the blog and news platforms are not great. People often complain that they miss important posts. I suppose photo sharing is integrated in messenger (the mobile app), too?