4 ms·

That's a really interesting point. I often fantasize about leaving "my" city of Frankfurt/Germany, but I always wonder if anywhere else is actually better for

That's a really interesting point. I often fantasize about leaving "my" city of Frankfurt/Germany, but I always wonder if anywhere else is actually better for ME, wherever on the bell curve I might be. Before I was 30 I became CTO of a great company here, i really wonder if I had made such a career anywhere else if I'd moved to somewhere with a more vibrant tech-scene where my specific skill combination isn't as relatively uncommon as it is here. Same with my lifestyle situation of being the working Dad in a one-income household. Doesn't matter that i'd be making a killing in SFBA if living with a family simply costs so much more there.

acchow 8y ago
If you're happy, stop fantasizing about leaving :) You already have a family. For younger people without responsibilities, I do suggest they think about the Bay Area. If you have the right set of skills, you can skyrocket your career rapidly. If you don't like it, move back home and hopefully you gained some valuable life experience. I've seen staff engineers at age 25 at Facebook and Google... Very rare, but having this amount of impact, responsibility, and trust from others is basically unheard of anywhere else (outside of other major Google offices worldwide).
- souprock 8y ago
  Perhaps you can skyrocket your career rapidly, at least in terms of tax bracket, but is that what you want your life to be about? My coworkers and I are doing all sorts of things that seem unlikely in the Bay Area. I have 11 kids. I once lived in San Jose, where that would not come cheap. The person in the office next to me has sheep on 11 acres, and he can shoot an AR-15 in his yard. He grew up in San Francisco, where that would be... difficult. Other people live in beach condos. If you aren't careful, you can let the years pass by while hoping that just a bit more will get you financially secure enough to do something you really want to do in your life. One day you notice that the years are just gone.
  - pm90 8y ago
    > I have 11 kids. I think its a pretty safe assumption that your paradigm of life differs significantly from most people on this forum. More concretely, having that many kids automatically make it a different calculus to decide an optimal place to live.
- pm90 8y ago
  Recently moved to the Bay from Austin. Got a lot of flak for going in the opposite direction, but I've been super happy with my decision. People talk of the quality of living difference, but if you don't have a family, that is complete bullshit. My compensation immediately doubled and even after paying higher taxes, paying higher rent and so on, I'm still saving substantially more, all the while when working with smarter people and learning a lot everyday. And if anything were to happen to my current job, there are SO MANY Opportunities that it wouldn't be hard to quickly find another job. Other benefits: your high comp lets you live close to work. Walking to work has been an amazing quality of life improvement in itself. Not worrying about traffic/train schedules relieves your brain of that added calculus (but it might just be that I worry too much). Perks are also better at SF based companies (catered lunch, better health plans, fresh coffee in the office etc.). SF food is comparable to Austin (although a lot more Michelin Starred restaurants, I'm not fancy enough to go to them regularly). And lastly the much touted Amazing weather. Its 100 in Austin right now but a cool 60 in SF.
rb2k_ 8y ago
> if living with a family simply costs so much more there. Being from Germany myself, the additional salary in the Bay Area usually compensates for the higher cost of living unless you're fresh out of University. At least that's what I've seen for Engineers that remain mostly technical in Germany. I don't exactly know what CTO salaries are like in Germany, but I'd assume it's usually less than 200k Euros. Most experienced Engineers in the Bay Area make easily more than that in total compensation (salary, bonus, RSUs). Even if you have to pay another 100k a year for rent/... , chances are you'd still come out ahead. Plus the weather is great. That being said, society is a lot different in Germany, so it's not just about money and job opportunities :)
- acchow 8y ago
  Yeah, I think for many engineers at the top companies they'd still come out way ahead even if they spent $100k more in rent. But realistically, rent is not that much higher. Maybe $20-40k more per year, depending on where you come from and how big your place (and family) is.
  - rb2k_ 8y ago
    Yeah, the 100k number was supposed to be rent and other things (food, child care, ...)

acchow 8y ago

If you're happy, stop fantasizing about leaving :) You already have a family. For younger people without responsibilities, I do suggest they think about the Bay Area. If you have the right set of skills, you can skyrocket your career rapidly. If you don't like it, move back home and hopefully you gained some valuable life experience. I've seen staff engineers at age 25 at Facebook and Google... Very rare, but having this amount of impact, responsibility, and trust from others is basically unheard of anywhere else (outside of other major Google offices worldwide).

souprock 8y ago
Perhaps you can skyrocket your career rapidly, at least in terms of tax bracket, but is that what you want your life to be about? My coworkers and I are doing all sorts of things that seem unlikely in the Bay Area. I have 11 kids. I once lived in San Jose, where that would not come cheap. The person in the office next to me has sheep on 11 acres, and he can shoot an AR-15 in his yard. He grew up in San Francisco, where that would be... difficult. Other people live in beach condos. If you aren't careful, you can let the years pass by while hoping that just a bit more will get you financially secure enough to do something you really want to do in your life. One day you notice that the years are just gone.
- pm90 8y ago
  > I have 11 kids. I think its a pretty safe assumption that your paradigm of life differs significantly from most people on this forum. More concretely, having that many kids automatically make it a different calculus to decide an optimal place to live.
pm90 8y ago
Recently moved to the Bay from Austin. Got a lot of flak for going in the opposite direction, but I've been super happy with my decision. People talk of the quality of living difference, but if you don't have a family, that is complete bullshit. My compensation immediately doubled and even after paying higher taxes, paying higher rent and so on, I'm still saving substantially more, all the while when working with smarter people and learning a lot everyday. And if anything were to happen to my current job, there are SO MANY Opportunities that it wouldn't be hard to quickly find another job. Other benefits: your high comp lets you live close to work. Walking to work has been an amazing quality of life improvement in itself. Not worrying about traffic/train schedules relieves your brain of that added calculus (but it might just be that I worry too much). Perks are also better at SF based companies (catered lunch, better health plans, fresh coffee in the office etc.). SF food is comparable to Austin (although a lot more Michelin Starred restaurants, I'm not fancy enough to go to them regularly). And lastly the much touted Amazing weather. Its 100 in Austin right now but a cool 60 in SF.

rb2k_ 8y ago

> if living with a family simply costs so much more there. Being from Germany myself, the additional salary in the Bay Area usually compensates for the higher cost of living unless you're fresh out of University. At least that's what I've seen for Engineers that remain mostly technical in Germany. I don't exactly know what CTO salaries are like in Germany, but I'd assume it's usually less than 200k Euros. Most experienced Engineers in the Bay Area make easily more than that in total compensation (salary, bonus, RSUs). Even if you have to pay another 100k a year for rent/... , chances are you'd still come out ahead. Plus the weather is great. That being said, society is a lot different in Germany, so it's not just about money and job opportunities :)

acchow 8y ago
Yeah, I think for many engineers at the top companies they'd still come out way ahead even if they spent $100k more in rent. But realistically, rent is not that much higher. Maybe $20-40k more per year, depending on where you come from and how big your place (and family) is.
- rb2k_ 8y ago
  Yeah, the 100k number was supposed to be rent and other things (food, child care, ...)