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>Up until age 39, I was never not given an offer after interviewing. Now after 40, my offer rate has dropped to 1 in 14. Sorry to say this, but get used, as I

>Up until age 39, I was never not given an offer after interviewing. Now after 40, my offer rate has dropped to 1 in 14. Sorry to say this, but get used, as I have, to getting flooded with employment offers that might as well have a note on the bottom that says "all are welcome to apply-EXCEPT YOU." Why they bother to waste resources to send these out is beyond me, unless they are just sadistic.

galieos_ghost 8y ago
Boggles my mind that companies do this. I'm just out of college and am amazed by the depth of knowledge older programmers have. A lot of them can find bugs on an almost instinctive level . I think it might come down to founders being insecure around older engineers who probably won't be afraid to call them out on dumb decisions and won't be as likely to drink the hpye kool-aid because they've seen it all before. Seems like an opportunity for startups to get great talent.
- john_moscow 8y ago
  There's a serious problem with the current economic cycle that basically makes technical expertise and efficiency irrelevant to the ways companies make money nowadays. It's a nasty thing to admit to yourself, but unless you do, you risk ending up exactly like that - no hire despite perfect technical skills due to unspoken reasons you didn't catch.
- gowld 8y ago
  Why would a founder want to hire someone who doesn't believe in their business?
  - logfromblammo 8y ago
    Because the majority of startups are bullshit businesses that are destined to fail, and only those who can recognize the intrinsic problems with them could ever help the founders pivot to something sane and profitable before the runway is gone.
  - s73v3r_ 8y ago
    I think the attitude that calling someone out on their bullshit is, "not believing in their business," is a huge part of the problem.
- logfromblammo 8y ago
  I once heard about a bug, diagnosed it, fixed it, and checked in the fix within a span of 15 minutes. The [younger] person who told me about it then looked at me like I was some kind of celestial being that inadvertently let their glamour slip for a moment--they were awestruck. Apparently, they had been struggling with it for a week. I didn't even realize it was a big deal. That's what hiring older people gets you. But you also have to connect them with younger people. And yeah, the corporate hype-ade gets dumped right into the potted plants now. But we don't exactly call people out on their dumb decisions, though, as much as factor them into future estimates. Telling truth to power gets you fired at most places, so you share your concerns only in private with your direct supervisor. Then you either polish up your resume again, or you work around all the dumb decisions that have already been made, plus the new one. If they didn't bother to consult with the expert before making that stupid plan, they're probably not going to listen to expert critiques after the fact. Always secure your own paycheck before helping out the company. They won't ever reward you for self-sacrifice.
ddtaylor 8y ago
Nobody can claim they are discriminating if they "offer jobs to "senior" devs as well. I have known people with disabilities that get similar treatment where it was very clear they wouldn't be hired but boxes had to be checked to - what appears - avoid liability.

galieos_ghost 8y ago

Boggles my mind that companies do this. I'm just out of college and am amazed by the depth of knowledge older programmers have. A lot of them can find bugs on an almost instinctive level . I think it might come down to founders being insecure around older engineers who probably won't be afraid to call them out on dumb decisions and won't be as likely to drink the hpye kool-aid because they've seen it all before. Seems like an opportunity for startups to get great talent.

john_moscow 8y ago
There's a serious problem with the current economic cycle that basically makes technical expertise and efficiency irrelevant to the ways companies make money nowadays. It's a nasty thing to admit to yourself, but unless you do, you risk ending up exactly like that - no hire despite perfect technical skills due to unspoken reasons you didn't catch.
gowld 8y ago
Why would a founder want to hire someone who doesn't believe in their business?
- logfromblammo 8y ago
  Because the majority of startups are bullshit businesses that are destined to fail, and only those who can recognize the intrinsic problems with them could ever help the founders pivot to something sane and profitable before the runway is gone.
- s73v3r_ 8y ago
  I think the attitude that calling someone out on their bullshit is, "not believing in their business," is a huge part of the problem.
logfromblammo 8y ago
I once heard about a bug, diagnosed it, fixed it, and checked in the fix within a span of 15 minutes. The [younger] person who told me about it then looked at me like I was some kind of celestial being that inadvertently let their glamour slip for a moment--they were awestruck. Apparently, they had been struggling with it for a week. I didn't even realize it was a big deal. That's what hiring older people gets you. But you also have to connect them with younger people. And yeah, the corporate hype-ade gets dumped right into the potted plants now. But we don't exactly call people out on their dumb decisions, though, as much as factor them into future estimates. Telling truth to power gets you fired at most places, so you share your concerns only in private with your direct supervisor. Then you either polish up your resume again, or you work around all the dumb decisions that have already been made, plus the new one. If they didn't bother to consult with the expert before making that stupid plan, they're probably not going to listen to expert critiques after the fact. Always secure your own paycheck before helping out the company. They won't ever reward you for self-sacrifice.

ddtaylor 8y ago

Nobody can claim they are discriminating if they "offer jobs to "senior" devs as well. I have known people with disabilities that get similar treatment where it was very clear they wouldn't be hired but boxes had to be checked to - what appears - avoid liability.