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That Emacs should not give an advantage to non-free operating systems. Now, because Emacs is free software, this doesn't prevent anyone such as Yamamoto to go

That Emacs should not give an advantage to non-free operating systems. Now, because Emacs is free software, this doesn't prevent anyone such as Yamamoto to go and modify Emacs. Rms doesn't want his officially-sanctioned version to have Mac-only improvements, but he also defends the GPL which allows other people to do so. Rms isn't going to go and tell Yamamoto to take down his fork or anything (but he probably will tell macOS users at every opportunity that they are working with an abusive OS).

na85 8y ago
It might be abusive in the sense that it's nonfree but at least it's functional. Year of the Linux desktop jokes aside, I've just lately got sick of how broken Linux is on most laptops, even ThinkPads which are supposed to be the gold standard. My ThinkPad never had working suspend resume, for example, which is just basic stuff that Linux can't seem to get right. I'm not 24 and childfree any more. I don't have time to fiddle with acpi or systemd.
- gaius 8y ago
  Still the only way to run Linux on your laptop and remain sane is to run it full-screen inside VirtualBox on OSX or Windows. I have been trying to do this for nearly 20 years now...
- jordigh 8y ago
  I've used two Thinkpads. I'm currently on an X1 5th gen running Debian stable and it's the most blissful computer experience I've ever had. Everything works, the damn thing is fast, 12 hours of battery life and it's so light. I don't understand this magic but I'm glad it's there. Previously I was on an x250 also on Debian stable which also worked flawlessly until I dropped it hard. It was just a little heavier and a little slower than my current X1. On the topic of Macs being stable; I've seen my coworkers experience a lot of grief during the past few months with some macOS updates. I'm not saying that the experience is in general better with one setup or another, just that mine has been good. I'm sure your experiences are valid too.
- jefurii 8y ago
  FWIW my wife and I have been running Debian on X-series Thinkpads for years with no problems except for having trouble some printers and with the occasional WiFi hotspot. Linux on the desktop Just Works in our experience. I have to run Windows 10 on a system for work and I have to say the Linux install and setup experience is way nicer.
skissane 8y ago
Couldn't one way out of the impasse be to enhance GNUstep to implement the macOS APIs/features which Yamamoto's fork uses? RMS doesn't want to add features only supported on proprietary platforms, but so long as one free software platform supports the same feature, that should answer RMS' objection.
- jordigh 8y ago
  Yes, this is more or less what rms wants to happen: that GNU gets the benefits of macOS. Then when both OSes can use those colourful emojis, he will accept the code into Emacs.
  - jasomill 8y ago
    One of the examples RMS gave where this happened (in GCC) relates directly to OS X history, viz., https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13224864 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13224864

na85 8y ago

It might be abusive in the sense that it's nonfree but at least it's functional. Year of the Linux desktop jokes aside, I've just lately got sick of how broken Linux is on most laptops, even ThinkPads which are supposed to be the gold standard. My ThinkPad never had working suspend resume, for example, which is just basic stuff that Linux can't seem to get right. I'm not 24 and childfree any more. I don't have time to fiddle with acpi or systemd.

gaius 8y ago
Still the only way to run Linux on your laptop and remain sane is to run it full-screen inside VirtualBox on OSX or Windows. I have been trying to do this for nearly 20 years now...
jordigh 8y ago
I've used two Thinkpads. I'm currently on an X1 5th gen running Debian stable and it's the most blissful computer experience I've ever had. Everything works, the damn thing is fast, 12 hours of battery life and it's so light. I don't understand this magic but I'm glad it's there. Previously I was on an x250 also on Debian stable which also worked flawlessly until I dropped it hard. It was just a little heavier and a little slower than my current X1. On the topic of Macs being stable; I've seen my coworkers experience a lot of grief during the past few months with some macOS updates. I'm not saying that the experience is in general better with one setup or another, just that mine has been good. I'm sure your experiences are valid too.
jefurii 8y ago
FWIW my wife and I have been running Debian on X-series Thinkpads for years with no problems except for having trouble some printers and with the occasional WiFi hotspot. Linux on the desktop Just Works in our experience. I have to run Windows 10 on a system for work and I have to say the Linux install and setup experience is way nicer.

skissane 8y ago

Couldn't one way out of the impasse be to enhance GNUstep to implement the macOS APIs/features which Yamamoto's fork uses? RMS doesn't want to add features only supported on proprietary platforms, but so long as one free software platform supports the same feature, that should answer RMS' objection.

jordigh 8y ago
Yes, this is more or less what rms wants to happen: that GNU gets the benefits of macOS. Then when both OSes can use those colourful emojis, he will accept the code into Emacs.
- jasomill 8y ago
  One of the examples RMS gave where this happened (in GCC) relates directly to OS X history, viz., https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13224864 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13224864