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DHH is saying "do" rather than "try". You can memorize every line of the emacs code base, but unless you have a problem with emacs itself that you'd like to so

DHH is saying "do" rather than "try". You can memorize every line of the emacs code base, but unless you have a problem with emacs itself that you'd like to solve, it isn't going to get you far. On the other hand, if you can't find a web-app to manage projects that works for you, and you decide to code one, you will learn much, much more.

jrockway 16y ago
I disagree. I would say I've learned about 40% of what I know about programming by typing stuff in and seeing if I like it. The other 60% I've learned by reading other people's code and stealing the techniques I like. For example, I learned C by myself when I was in middle school. The memory management technique I developed independently was "the library allocates, the application frees". No errors in valgrind, and my app works. Then I started reading other people's C code, and switched my technique to "the application allocates, the application frees". Now C is a lot easier to write! Assuming that you're the smartest person on Earth only gets you to a local maximum. To get to the global maximum, you have to interact with other people. The way you interact with programmers is with source code.
- run4yourlives 16y ago
  I think you've possibly hit on a fundamental difference between learning styles that people have. I've learned probably 95% of all my programming from doing. I do take issue though with the idea that the learn by doing crowd is somehow less accomplished. It smacks of baseless elitism.
  - dlo 16y ago
    Isn't thinking that others have little to offer to you a form of elitism as well? It seems neither option is particularly humble.
    - spiffytech 16y ago
      It's not that others have little to offer, it's a different style of learning. Just like some people are visual or auditory learners, some are kinesthetic learners. Seeing other people's code does little for me because I miss all of the reasoning that went into it's creation. However, when I've fought through the same problem myself, I understand very thoroughly the traps, pitfalls, and solutions the task entails. When I reach this level, I can read other people's code and clearly see why they did what they did, and how it's better or worse than my method. I have to take a crack at the problem myself first, though, in order to learn well. Reading other people's code is, for me, a way to refine and reinforce my techniques, not to learn entirely new things. I learn much less effectively when I try that.
- hello_moto 16y ago
  I read a lot of books, but tend to forget most of them as well.

jrockway 16y ago

I disagree. I would say I've learned about 40% of what I know about programming by typing stuff in and seeing if I like it. The other 60% I've learned by reading other people's code and stealing the techniques I like. For example, I learned C by myself when I was in middle school. The memory management technique I developed independently was "the library allocates, the application frees". No errors in valgrind, and my app works. Then I started reading other people's C code, and switched my technique to "the application allocates, the application frees". Now C is a lot easier to write! Assuming that you're the smartest person on Earth only gets you to a local maximum. To get to the global maximum, you have to interact with other people. The way you interact with programmers is with source code.

run4yourlives 16y ago
I think you've possibly hit on a fundamental difference between learning styles that people have. I've learned probably 95% of all my programming from doing. I do take issue though with the idea that the learn by doing crowd is somehow less accomplished. It smacks of baseless elitism.
- dlo 16y ago
  Isn't thinking that others have little to offer to you a form of elitism as well? It seems neither option is particularly humble.
  - spiffytech 16y ago
    It's not that others have little to offer, it's a different style of learning. Just like some people are visual or auditory learners, some are kinesthetic learners. Seeing other people's code does little for me because I miss all of the reasoning that went into it's creation. However, when I've fought through the same problem myself, I understand very thoroughly the traps, pitfalls, and solutions the task entails. When I reach this level, I can read other people's code and clearly see why they did what they did, and how it's better or worse than my method. I have to take a crack at the problem myself first, though, in order to learn well. Reading other people's code is, for me, a way to refine and reinforce my techniques, not to learn entirely new things. I learn much less effectively when I try that.
hello_moto 16y ago
I read a lot of books, but tend to forget most of them as well.