6 ms·

I was once invited by (and paid for by) a billionaire investor in the company I worked for to a resort in the Bahamas patroned exclusively by the rich and famou

by eric_h 8y ago

I was once invited by (and paid for by) a billionaire investor in the company I worked for to a resort in the Bahamas patroned exclusively by the rich and famous. The extent of the service offered by the (mostly black, Bahamian staff) — appearing, disappearing and offering way more attentive assistance than any reasonable person needs made me downright uncomfortable. It was lovely to be in paradise, but being waited on hand and foot just seemed wretchedly excessive. [edit: spelling]

dweekly 8y ago
You may find this short piece by David Foster Wallace amusing on the same theme: https://harpers.org/wp-content/uploads/2008/09/HarpersMagazine-1996-01-0007859.pdf https://harpers.org/wp-content/uploads/2008/09/HarpersMagazi...
- dougmwne 8y ago
  Thanks for sharing this. It contains an insightful critic of native advertising starting at the end of page 9 that's doubbly worth a read.
kkielhofner 8y ago
It probably varies by person but I've experienced a version of this at Four Seasons and Ritz properties. On one hand I respect the incredible training, homogenization, attention to detail, etc. It really is amazing - impossible to compare their level of service to any other chain/organization at that price point (top 1%, not 0.01%). On the other hand after about a day or so and the novelty wears off it starts to seem a little "creepy" in a Stepford Wives/Get Out/etc kind of way... On a couple of occasions I was so uncomfortable I literally pulled someone aside and said "Come on, level with me dude. This isn't real. You don't really talk like this." In most cases they would respond with something along the lines of "Sir, I'm sorry but I don't know what you're referring to". It never quite rang as genuine but I couldn't help but wonder if the staff is trained or programmed. I know some people/families/etc who have never experienced lodging, accommodation, service, etc at any lesser level and it made me really wonder how aware they are of the bubble they're in (and how strange it really is).
- nerdponx 8y ago
  I think some people actually take pride in being able to provide that kind of service. I'm not sure how many of them actually fall into that category.
  - Silhouette 8y ago
    I'm quite sure some some people do take pride in providing that level of service. There have been some fascinating fly-on-the-wall documentaries in the world of ultra-high net worth individuals recently -- top-end hotels, exclusive services you'd never imagine existed, and so on. Some of the people interviewed seemed to be genuinely happy, and often proud of what they did and their ability to satisfy obscure requests or handle strange emergencies or pay extraordinary attention to details. It also wasn't uncommon for people in low-ranking jobs to be asked if they'd like to swap places with their clients and practically fall over themselves to say no. As one of the cleaners at a world-class London hotel said, she doesn't earn as much in a year as her current guest earns in an hour, and the bed does look comfy, but at least when her work is done for the day she won't need to be surrounded by security guards before she can even leave the building.
    - B1FF_PSUVM 8y ago
      Sword of Damocles right there.
  - kkielhofner 8y ago
    Some people definitely do and I've encountered many of them in high end dining (as an example). However, the experiences I've had with staff at these properties are totally unlike that. Probably the closest comparison I can make are the well-known rules for Disney employees. Every employee on Disney property is essentially in costume and portraying a character, whether they're in a physical costume or not - to the point where every employee is referred to as a "cast member". These brands have their systems, procedure, and process down to the point where virtually no personality or individualism is expressed by individual staff. Excellent for service and experience, but as referenced in my original comment, it can kind of cross over into "uncanny valley" territory and get unsettling.
ryanwaggoner 8y ago
Genuinely not trying to sound like an asshole, but do you mean "wretchedly"?
- eric_h 8y ago
  Yes. Brain fart.
Gruklair 8y ago
You just need to get used to it. Its hard to find anything really exclusive near Silicon Valley, so we usually go to Macau once in a while.
ggg9990 8y ago
I think Americans particularly dislike this obsequious type of service. People from other countries love it. Steve Jobs famously had very little household help and their family did their own household chores for a very simple reason that he couldn’t buy his way out of — he didn’t like strangers in his fucking house all the time. The best writing on this is of course David Foster Wallace for Harper’s.
- closeparen 8y ago
  Agatha Christie: “As a child I never dreamed that I would be so poor that I could not afford a servant, not so rich as to own a motor car.” This varies widely around the world. I lived with an international student who was definitely from an upper middle class family but not a billionaire by any means; the family had several household staff, and that was just a normal luxury in the way that an American family might have a dishwasher.
  - ggg9990 8y ago
    I can’t speak for all Americans, but in New England most people would rather spend $5000 on a dishwasher than $4000 on lifetime dishwashing services from a person. I don’t want someone in my house and putting away dishes isn’t so agonizing that I need to avoid it.
    - closeparen 8y ago
      I also wouldn’t want to live with my extended family in the same house. I’m guessing that past a point, home is more of an active communal space than a private retreat, so what’s a few more people?
- lkrubner 8y ago
  In the USA, in restaurants, the wait staff get most of their income from tips. Because of this, they are ridiculously obsequious. Female wait staff tolerate a grotesque amount of sexual harassment, because if they complain then they lose their income. Compare that to the wait staff in Europe, which does not expect tips and who do not depend on tips for their income.

by eric_h 8y ago

dweekly 8y ago

You may find this short piece by David Foster Wallace amusing on the same theme: https://harpers.org/wp-content/uploads/2008/09/HarpersMagazine-1996-01-0007859.pdf https://harpers.org/wp-content/uploads/2008/09/HarpersMagazi...

dougmwne 8y ago
Thanks for sharing this. It contains an insightful critic of native advertising starting at the end of page 9 that's doubbly worth a read.

kkielhofner 8y ago

It probably varies by person but I've experienced a version of this at Four Seasons and Ritz properties. On one hand I respect the incredible training, homogenization, attention to detail, etc. It really is amazing - impossible to compare their level of service to any other chain/organization at that price point (top 1%, not 0.01%). On the other hand after about a day or so and the novelty wears off it starts to seem a little "creepy" in a Stepford Wives/Get Out/etc kind of way... On a couple of occasions I was so uncomfortable I literally pulled someone aside and said "Come on, level with me dude. This isn't real. You don't really talk like this." In most cases they would respond with something along the lines of "Sir, I'm sorry but I don't know what you're referring to". It never quite rang as genuine but I couldn't help but wonder if the staff is trained or programmed. I know some people/families/etc who have never experienced lodging, accommodation, service, etc at any lesser level and it made me really wonder how aware they are of the bubble they're in (and how strange it really is).

nerdponx 8y ago
I think some people actually take pride in being able to provide that kind of service. I'm not sure how many of them actually fall into that category.
- Silhouette 8y ago
  I'm quite sure some some people do take pride in providing that level of service. There have been some fascinating fly-on-the-wall documentaries in the world of ultra-high net worth individuals recently -- top-end hotels, exclusive services you'd never imagine existed, and so on. Some of the people interviewed seemed to be genuinely happy, and often proud of what they did and their ability to satisfy obscure requests or handle strange emergencies or pay extraordinary attention to details. It also wasn't uncommon for people in low-ranking jobs to be asked if they'd like to swap places with their clients and practically fall over themselves to say no. As one of the cleaners at a world-class London hotel said, she doesn't earn as much in a year as her current guest earns in an hour, and the bed does look comfy, but at least when her work is done for the day she won't need to be surrounded by security guards before she can even leave the building.
  - B1FF_PSUVM 8y ago
    Sword of Damocles right there.
- kkielhofner 8y ago
  Some people definitely do and I've encountered many of them in high end dining (as an example). However, the experiences I've had with staff at these properties are totally unlike that. Probably the closest comparison I can make are the well-known rules for Disney employees. Every employee on Disney property is essentially in costume and portraying a character, whether they're in a physical costume or not - to the point where every employee is referred to as a "cast member". These brands have their systems, procedure, and process down to the point where virtually no personality or individualism is expressed by individual staff. Excellent for service and experience, but as referenced in my original comment, it can kind of cross over into "uncanny valley" territory and get unsettling.

ryanwaggoner 8y ago

Genuinely not trying to sound like an asshole, but do you mean "wretchedly"?

eric_h 8y ago
Yes. Brain fart.

Gruklair 8y ago

You just need to get used to it. Its hard to find anything really exclusive near Silicon Valley, so we usually go to Macau once in a while.

ggg9990 8y ago

I think Americans particularly dislike this obsequious type of service. People from other countries love it. Steve Jobs famously had very little household help and their family did their own household chores for a very simple reason that he couldn’t buy his way out of — he didn’t like strangers in his fucking house all the time. The best writing on this is of course David Foster Wallace for Harper’s.

closeparen 8y ago
Agatha Christie: “As a child I never dreamed that I would be so poor that I could not afford a servant, not so rich as to own a motor car.” This varies widely around the world. I lived with an international student who was definitely from an upper middle class family but not a billionaire by any means; the family had several household staff, and that was just a normal luxury in the way that an American family might have a dishwasher.
- ggg9990 8y ago
  I can’t speak for all Americans, but in New England most people would rather spend $5000 on a dishwasher than $4000 on lifetime dishwashing services from a person. I don’t want someone in my house and putting away dishes isn’t so agonizing that I need to avoid it.
  - closeparen 8y ago
    I also wouldn’t want to live with my extended family in the same house. I’m guessing that past a point, home is more of an active communal space than a private retreat, so what’s a few more people?
lkrubner 8y ago
In the USA, in restaurants, the wait staff get most of their income from tips. Because of this, they are ridiculously obsequious. Female wait staff tolerate a grotesque amount of sexual harassment, because if they complain then they lose their income. Compare that to the wait staff in Europe, which does not expect tips and who do not depend on tips for their income.