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redhat finally went where it truly belongs since decades ago: web rather than OS implementation. Now, if they would so kind as to exit OS design and implementa

redhat finally went where it truly belongs since decades ago: web rather than OS implementation. Now, if they would so kind as to exit OS design and implementation, stage right, that would be awesome. The faster the better.

prlin 8y ago
What’s wrong with Redhat Linux?
- jitl 8y ago
  Perhaps Systemd? RedHat kinda forced it on the rest of the ecosystem from their position of power in the distro world. (I don’t hold such a grievance myself, but have seen enough systemd hate to understand the position)
  - lima 8y ago
    This isn't getting more true each time it's mentioned. They did not force it on anyone, other distros adopted it.
- Annatar 8y ago
  redhat couldn't engineer an operating system to save their life: systemd is a Windows-like system, they constantly break backwards compatibility, their compiler is purposely castrated to only produce 64-bit code, memory overcommit is still a thing and ships out of the box turned on, they can't get NFS to work correctly and haven't been able to for decades, they can't get fiberchannel to work correctly, they resisted and sabotaged XFS for decades only to now make it a default after having made their customers to suffer with ext2, 3, and 4 for twenty years, they resist ZFS, they've allowed netstat to be deprecated in favor of ss, both GFS and GFS 2 are disasters which they could never get to work correctly, Puppet is a disaster, Saltstack is a disaster, Cobbler is a disaster, Satellite / Spacewalk is a disaster... seriously, what can redhat do correctly? They spend more time arguing with paying customers on bugzilla.redhat.com than fixing their code because it's easier to argue than to find out where the problem is, or to solve the problem properly.
  - thefuzzy 8y ago
    I'm with you. Red Hat is trying to stay relevant, but it seems that their management has no idea what is going on...or what to do outside of RHEL.
    - lima 8y ago
      IMO Red Hat has been on top of recent developments. OpenShift is (arguably) the best PaaS Kubernetes distribution, and certainly the most enterprise-ready one. I use it in production and it's a great piece of engineering. They heavily contribute back to Kubernetes upstream instead of forking it. Red Hat is responsible for many important Kubernetes features like RBAC. They acquired Ansible and, recently, CoreOS. Software Collections make it really easy to run an up-to-date software stack on RHEL by decoupling it from the base OS (which is the way to go, IMO). And of all the IdPs I recently evaluated, Keycloak sucks the least.
      - Annatar 8y ago
        The thing is, all of that is like stone tools are to spaceships when compared with SmartOS and Triton.
        lima 8y ago
        Legitimately curious: the main issue with running containers on Linux is the bad state of the Linux kernel as far as security is concerned. Even with SELinux, it's risky to run multi-tenant containers on Linux due to the massive attack surface, necessitating things like [1] or lightweight VMs. How does SmartOS solve this? Also, does the Joyent stack have an OpenShift equivalent? Triton wants my credit card details to sign up with their public cloud, but I might grab a spare box and give it a try. [1]: https://github.com/google/gvisor https://github.com/google/gvisor
        Annatar 8y ago
        https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17067854 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17067854 ...if after reading that you still have specific questions, ask. You don't need a credit card, if you don't want to run it on Joyent's servers, you can run Triton for free on your own at home, at work, (or someone else's) infrastructure. All of that technology is freely available at Github at no cost other than reading a little bit of documentation and investing some time to set it up following the instructions. Out of curiosity, do Digital Ocean, Hetzner, Azure or AWS not ask for a credit card?
nameiscubanpete 8y ago
I use debian for my own stuff, but always push for RHEL/CentOS at work. Why? Because it's easy to persuade people into keeping the damn systems updated. As long as you stay within the same major version, updates don't break builds or require new rounds of QA.
- danpalmer 8y ago
  Isn’t that the pitch of Debian as well? We use it at work because of that.
  - nameiscubanpete 8y ago
    It could be. I got into this mode of thinking many years ago and Debian may be just as suitable nowadays.

prlin 8y ago

What’s wrong with Redhat Linux?

jitl 8y ago
Perhaps Systemd? RedHat kinda forced it on the rest of the ecosystem from their position of power in the distro world. (I don’t hold such a grievance myself, but have seen enough systemd hate to understand the position)
- lima 8y ago
  This isn't getting more true each time it's mentioned. They did not force it on anyone, other distros adopted it.
Annatar 8y ago
redhat couldn't engineer an operating system to save their life: systemd is a Windows-like system, they constantly break backwards compatibility, their compiler is purposely castrated to only produce 64-bit code, memory overcommit is still a thing and ships out of the box turned on, they can't get NFS to work correctly and haven't been able to for decades, they can't get fiberchannel to work correctly, they resisted and sabotaged XFS for decades only to now make it a default after having made their customers to suffer with ext2, 3, and 4 for twenty years, they resist ZFS, they've allowed netstat to be deprecated in favor of ss, both GFS and GFS 2 are disasters which they could never get to work correctly, Puppet is a disaster, Saltstack is a disaster, Cobbler is a disaster, Satellite / Spacewalk is a disaster... seriously, what can redhat do correctly? They spend more time arguing with paying customers on bugzilla.redhat.com than fixing their code because it's easier to argue than to find out where the problem is, or to solve the problem properly.
- thefuzzy 8y ago
  I'm with you. Red Hat is trying to stay relevant, but it seems that their management has no idea what is going on...or what to do outside of RHEL.
  - lima 8y ago
    IMO Red Hat has been on top of recent developments. OpenShift is (arguably) the best PaaS Kubernetes distribution, and certainly the most enterprise-ready one. I use it in production and it's a great piece of engineering. They heavily contribute back to Kubernetes upstream instead of forking it. Red Hat is responsible for many important Kubernetes features like RBAC. They acquired Ansible and, recently, CoreOS. Software Collections make it really easy to run an up-to-date software stack on RHEL by decoupling it from the base OS (which is the way to go, IMO). And of all the IdPs I recently evaluated, Keycloak sucks the least.
    - Annatar 8y ago
      The thing is, all of that is like stone tools are to spaceships when compared with SmartOS and Triton.
      - lima 8y ago
        Legitimately curious: the main issue with running containers on Linux is the bad state of the Linux kernel as far as security is concerned. Even with SELinux, it's risky to run multi-tenant containers on Linux due to the massive attack surface, necessitating things like [1] or lightweight VMs. How does SmartOS solve this? Also, does the Joyent stack have an OpenShift equivalent? Triton wants my credit card details to sign up with their public cloud, but I might grab a spare box and give it a try. [1]: https://github.com/google/gvisor https://github.com/google/gvisor
        Annatar 8y ago
        https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17067854 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17067854 ...if after reading that you still have specific questions, ask. You don't need a credit card, if you don't want to run it on Joyent's servers, you can run Triton for free on your own at home, at work, (or someone else's) infrastructure. All of that technology is freely available at Github at no cost other than reading a little bit of documentation and investing some time to set it up following the instructions. Out of curiosity, do Digital Ocean, Hetzner, Azure or AWS not ask for a credit card?

nameiscubanpete 8y ago

I use debian for my own stuff, but always push for RHEL/CentOS at work. Why? Because it's easy to persuade people into keeping the damn systems updated. As long as you stay within the same major version, updates don't break builds or require new rounds of QA.

danpalmer 8y ago
Isn’t that the pitch of Debian as well? We use it at work because of that.
- nameiscubanpete 8y ago
  It could be. I got into this mode of thinking many years ago and Debian may be just as suitable nowadays.