4 ms·

Not sure why the doom and gloom. Because they can carry on as always except in Europe. If that's 90% of their base then yes, they may have problems. For such c

Not sure why the doom and gloom. Because they can carry on as always except in Europe. If that's 90% of their base then yes, they may have problems. For such companies GDPR simply shrinks profits, no?

kungtotte 8y ago
GDPR applies for non-EU based operations as long as the users are EU-based. I guess theoretically they only have to comply with GDPR specifically for EU-based operations and/or EU citizens, so they could technically keep at it if their servers are outside the EU and for any non-EU users. But I think in the long run it'll be easier to have sitewide compliance.
- dahdum 8y ago
  Sitewide compliance could reduce revenue worldwide, in those cases it could often make sense to exit the EU market entirely.
  - kungtotte 8y ago
    That is of course one alternative. Depending on your business it might be viable, but the EU is a pretty big market to skip out on assuming your business model itself doesn't violate the GDPR.
  - s73v3r_ 8y ago
    If the only reason you're making money is by disrespecting your user's privacy, then one has to question whether you should be in business in the first place.
    - dahdum 8y ago
      GDPR isn’t perfect, and those not in compliance with a new, vaguely written, policy aren’t automatically evil.
      - s73v3r_ 8y ago
        The policy is 2 years old. It's hardly new; there was lots of time to ask questions and come into compliance.
        dahdum 8y ago
        Plenty of time to ask questions but no one who can give straight answers.
mrweasel 8y ago
Europe is 500 million potential users, so if you're not privately held, then you also need to explain to stockholders that you intent to leave that market open to competitors. Sure all EU citizens aren't equally wealthy, but a large number of those 500 million are in a lucrative segment. Let's say that Instagram decides that the EU isn't worth the hassle, and leaves. Now competitors have 500 million users to target and build a platform for, without the annoying interference from US based companies. If some is successful under the GDPR, there's no real reason they could easily enter other, less strict markets later, using the profit from their EU business,.
- Spearchucker 8y ago
  The assumption is Pintrest can't be successful in the EU.
- taysic 8y ago
  There are some services that wouldn't exist if it wasn't for targeted advertising. Instagram may have millions of users in the EU but how many would pay for the service? The number that would probably would not be enough to sustain the network effect. And if Instagram users switched to mainly non-targeted advertising, Instagram may find itself not making enough money to sustain its company. While a 'competitor' willing to make less money could show up, their ability to collect / store photos or videos / update the ui / filter out inappropriate content would be decreased if they were barely profitable, making it a less useful service than Instagram was.
roel_v 8y ago
I didn't mean it as 'doom and gloom' - I'm just interested in the economics and management/business aspects of it. Is it possible to turn a company around that has 'ads' woven so deeply in its DNA? Would such a company just give up on a target demographic sized 500mm? What would that do to their valuation and funding? Maybe the answer is 'nothing', I'm not sure - but plenty of companies were punished by the markets the last 15 years for not at least trying to get into Chinese and Indian markets, which are (if you only count the people that can actually buy something) much smaller than the EU, and much harder to break into culturally.
taysic 8y ago
Shrinks profits or destroys their business model (ie apps/games that people wouldn't buy but survive well on targeted advertising)

kungtotte 8y ago

GDPR applies for non-EU based operations as long as the users are EU-based. I guess theoretically they only have to comply with GDPR specifically for EU-based operations and/or EU citizens, so they could technically keep at it if their servers are outside the EU and for any non-EU users. But I think in the long run it'll be easier to have sitewide compliance.

dahdum 8y ago
Sitewide compliance could reduce revenue worldwide, in those cases it could often make sense to exit the EU market entirely.
- kungtotte 8y ago
  That is of course one alternative. Depending on your business it might be viable, but the EU is a pretty big market to skip out on assuming your business model itself doesn't violate the GDPR.
- s73v3r_ 8y ago
  If the only reason you're making money is by disrespecting your user's privacy, then one has to question whether you should be in business in the first place.
  - dahdum 8y ago
    GDPR isn’t perfect, and those not in compliance with a new, vaguely written, policy aren’t automatically evil.
    - s73v3r_ 8y ago
      The policy is 2 years old. It's hardly new; there was lots of time to ask questions and come into compliance.
      - dahdum 8y ago
        Plenty of time to ask questions but no one who can give straight answers.

mrweasel 8y ago

Europe is 500 million potential users, so if you're not privately held, then you also need to explain to stockholders that you intent to leave that market open to competitors. Sure all EU citizens aren't equally wealthy, but a large number of those 500 million are in a lucrative segment. Let's say that Instagram decides that the EU isn't worth the hassle, and leaves. Now competitors have 500 million users to target and build a platform for, without the annoying interference from US based companies. If some is successful under the GDPR, there's no real reason they could easily enter other, less strict markets later, using the profit from their EU business,.

Spearchucker 8y ago
The assumption is Pintrest can't be successful in the EU.
taysic 8y ago
There are some services that wouldn't exist if it wasn't for targeted advertising. Instagram may have millions of users in the EU but how many would pay for the service? The number that would probably would not be enough to sustain the network effect. And if Instagram users switched to mainly non-targeted advertising, Instagram may find itself not making enough money to sustain its company. While a 'competitor' willing to make less money could show up, their ability to collect / store photos or videos / update the ui / filter out inappropriate content would be decreased if they were barely profitable, making it a less useful service than Instagram was.

roel_v 8y ago

I didn't mean it as 'doom and gloom' - I'm just interested in the economics and management/business aspects of it. Is it possible to turn a company around that has 'ads' woven so deeply in its DNA? Would such a company just give up on a target demographic sized 500mm? What would that do to their valuation and funding? Maybe the answer is 'nothing', I'm not sure - but plenty of companies were punished by the markets the last 15 years for not at least trying to get into Chinese and Indian markets, which are (if you only count the people that can actually buy something) much smaller than the EU, and much harder to break into culturally.

taysic 8y ago

Shrinks profits or destroys their business model (ie apps/games that people wouldn't buy but survive well on targeted advertising)