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> it is also likely to cannibalize sales of the Model S so the net benefit to the bottom line might be negligible I'm skeptical of this. This is like saying th

by lgbr 8y ago

> it is also likely to cannibalize sales of the Model S so the net benefit to the bottom line might be negligible I'm skeptical of this. This is like saying that BMW's 1-series cannibalizes sales of its 3-series. There's a huge difference in comfort, space, performance, and practicality between the Model S and the 3. If a Model S is at all within your budget, even the base Model S is going to be a whole lot more car than almost any Model 3. Beyond that, there's easy ways for Tesla to sweeten the deal. For me, Tesla offering free supercharging on the Model S but not on the Model 3 had me order a Model S immediately.

dragontamer 8y ago
> Beyond that, there's easy ways for Tesla to sweeten the deal. For me, Tesla offering free supercharging on the Model S but not on the Model 3 had me order a Model S immediately. Why not just buy supercharging on the Model3?
- Bedon292 8y ago
  They aren't offering unlimited supercharging on the 3. It is just pay per use. Unlimited has a lot of value to it over a lifetime.
- lgbr 8y ago
  Because free supercharging easily makes up for the price difference. Some poeple use something like 4 supercharges a week, which at $20 a charge means $160/month.
  - dragontamer 8y ago
    > Because free supercharging easily makes up for the price difference. Some poeple use something like 4 supercharges a week, which at $20 a charge means $160/month. 4-supercharges a week implies ~1000+ miles per week. And its only ~$9 a super-charge last time I checked (https://twitter.com/TheRealPTFI/status/920306238830735361/photo/1 https://twitter.com/TheRealPTFI/status/920306238830735361/ph...) If the car lasts to 300,000 miles at 250-miles per super-charge and $10 per charge, that's $12,000 over the lifetime of the car. And that's a relatively extreme case. No charging at home, no charging at work, no charging anywhere except at super-chargers for all 300,000 miles of your car's lifetime. An absolutely absurd result but still doesn't make the Model3 comparable to ModelS. And hell if I'm going to a charger if I buy a car like this. I'm buying a home-charging station so that I don't ever have to go somewhere else to charge. Charge at night every day forevermore. ----------- Note that the Model S and Model X only receive 400kWh of supercharger credits per year (~1000 miles). So what, that's like $100 / year?? After that, you have to pay supercharger fees. So its not like your extreme use case even saves much money.
    - lgbr 8y ago
      > And its only ~$9 a super-charge last time I checked Prices on superchargers were raised: https://www.theverge.com/2018/3/12/17110904/tesla-supercharger-stations-price-raise https://www.theverge.com/2018/3/12/17110904/tesla-supercharg... It's approximately $22 now, and more in places where electricity prices are higher. This raises your estimate to around $24,000 over the course of 300,000 miles. The 400 kWh of free supercharging is only if you don't have a referral. Buyers with a referral receive unlimited supercharging. This isn't an absurd number, either. There are commuters, salesmen, and others that simply drive a lot who easily manage 50,000 to 100,000 miles in a year. (There are hundreds of 2015 and newer cars on AutoTrader currently with over 300,000 miles). But you don't even have to drive that much for it to be worth it. The Model S has an 8 year powertrain warranty with unlimited mileage (which the Model 3 does not), over the course of which you save about $10,000 for every 100,000 supercharger miles you use.
URSpider94 8y ago
That would depend on how many people were buying the Model S simply because it was the only Tesla sedan available at the time. The more you add premium features like performance mode and dual-motor to the 3, you increase the chance that someone who was considering the S might down-grade to the 3. Even today, if you want a Tesla sedan NOW, you need to buy an S (or an X, if you're looking for an SUV). Once the 3 burns through the existing reservations (which I suspect may happen fairly quickly, given that many people will choose to hold out for the $35k unicorn), then new buyers who want a car within a period of weeks will be able to choose.
sliken 8y ago
I've heard that before, but it puzzles me. Any tesla doesn't seem particularly attractive unless you can charge it at home. After all who wants to visit superchargers often when they are radically slower than a gas station? So assuming you mostly charge at home (with a 300 mile range each day), seems like needing supercharging would be pretty rare, like say the occasional (over 300 mile) roadtrip. So you buy a $100k car instead of a $50-$60k car to occasionally save $10?

by lgbr 8y ago

dragontamer 8y ago

> Beyond that, there's easy ways for Tesla to sweeten the deal. For me, Tesla offering free supercharging on the Model S but not on the Model 3 had me order a Model S immediately. Why not just buy supercharging on the Model3?

Bedon292 8y ago
They aren't offering unlimited supercharging on the 3. It is just pay per use. Unlimited has a lot of value to it over a lifetime.
lgbr 8y ago
Because free supercharging easily makes up for the price difference. Some poeple use something like 4 supercharges a week, which at $20 a charge means $160/month.
- dragontamer 8y ago
  > Because free supercharging easily makes up for the price difference. Some poeple use something like 4 supercharges a week, which at $20 a charge means $160/month. 4-supercharges a week implies ~1000+ miles per week. And its only ~$9 a super-charge last time I checked (https://twitter.com/TheRealPTFI/status/920306238830735361/photo/1 https://twitter.com/TheRealPTFI/status/920306238830735361/ph...) If the car lasts to 300,000 miles at 250-miles per super-charge and $10 per charge, that's $12,000 over the lifetime of the car. And that's a relatively extreme case. No charging at home, no charging at work, no charging anywhere except at super-chargers for all 300,000 miles of your car's lifetime. An absolutely absurd result but still doesn't make the Model3 comparable to ModelS. And hell if I'm going to a charger if I buy a car like this. I'm buying a home-charging station so that I don't ever have to go somewhere else to charge. Charge at night every day forevermore. ----------- Note that the Model S and Model X only receive 400kWh of supercharger credits per year (~1000 miles). So what, that's like $100 / year?? After that, you have to pay supercharger fees. So its not like your extreme use case even saves much money.
  - lgbr 8y ago
    > And its only ~$9 a super-charge last time I checked Prices on superchargers were raised: https://www.theverge.com/2018/3/12/17110904/tesla-supercharger-stations-price-raise https://www.theverge.com/2018/3/12/17110904/tesla-supercharg... It's approximately $22 now, and more in places where electricity prices are higher. This raises your estimate to around $24,000 over the course of 300,000 miles. The 400 kWh of free supercharging is only if you don't have a referral. Buyers with a referral receive unlimited supercharging. This isn't an absurd number, either. There are commuters, salesmen, and others that simply drive a lot who easily manage 50,000 to 100,000 miles in a year. (There are hundreds of 2015 and newer cars on AutoTrader currently with over 300,000 miles). But you don't even have to drive that much for it to be worth it. The Model S has an 8 year powertrain warranty with unlimited mileage (which the Model 3 does not), over the course of which you save about $10,000 for every 100,000 supercharger miles you use.

URSpider94 8y ago

That would depend on how many people were buying the Model S simply because it was the only Tesla sedan available at the time. The more you add premium features like performance mode and dual-motor to the 3, you increase the chance that someone who was considering the S might down-grade to the 3. Even today, if you want a Tesla sedan NOW, you need to buy an S (or an X, if you're looking for an SUV). Once the 3 burns through the existing reservations (which I suspect may happen fairly quickly, given that many people will choose to hold out for the $35k unicorn), then new buyers who want a car within a period of weeks will be able to choose.

sliken 8y ago

I've heard that before, but it puzzles me. Any tesla doesn't seem particularly attractive unless you can charge it at home. After all who wants to visit superchargers often when they are radically slower than a gas station? So assuming you mostly charge at home (with a 300 mile range each day), seems like needing supercharging would be pretty rare, like say the occasional (over 300 mile) roadtrip. So you buy a $100k car instead of a $50-$60k car to occasionally save $10?